Big Dipper derailed

[Rob]

Wheel failure can't be that uncommon - a ride at Alton Towers lost a wheel February 2010, and was evacuated.

Do enlighten me....

Wheel assembly failure isn't common. It's a rare event, but one of the more common accidents. Metal fatigue is usually the culprit, and can happen due to poor fabrication (ie: Rush 2008), poor maintenance and fabrication (ie: Mindbender 1986) or just poor maintenance.

Anyway, you don't have to worry about this killing off the bigger dipper, I'm sure the place will go bankrupt far sooner =P

 

[Anonymous]

This has got to show neglect by PBB though, I quite like the park and I am not one to bash parks for no reason, but you can only be unlucky so many times.

Rubish.

Unless your mechanics have a crystall ball and can predict when an act of God like this happens, no amount of checks can prepair for it. PB often finds itself under fire for maintance, somthing I find odd.

The way some people are going on you'd think the ride had never stalled on that section of track before last August.

Ash

 

[furie]

The way some people are going on you'd think the ride had never stalled on that section of track before last August.
Ash

Well, I'm glad they took note of that fact and acted on the problem before there was a major accident

The train didn't stall, part of the wheel assembly failed in a pretty bad way and caused it to come off the track. If this is a common thing to happen at PBB, then they ARE neglectful.

As was, I thought it was just a bad bit of luck, but it appears there's more to it than that if this kind of thing is a regular occurance...

 

[nealbie]

Unless your mechanics have a crystall ball and can predict when an act of God like this happens, no amount of checks can prepair for it. PB often finds itself under fire for maintance, somthing I find odd.

Whilst on the whole you are no doubt right that the Pleasure Beach mechanics go through all of the necessary (take a highlighter to the word necessary) checks to ensure that the ride is safe and nothing of this magnitude will happen on a regular basis. That is, in spite of the fact that they seem to have awfully bad luck with things like this happening - as well as Thorpe. Reputations don't spring up over night you know .

.. I still find it mildly bizarre that you are slating Brookes' opinion on the matter, as if the National Geographic channel has taught me anything, it's that he's almost entirely correct!

Now, back to the word "necessary" which I alluded to earlier. I know that you only have to check for metal fatigue (by law) every so many miles. (With the exception of planes which have to be checked between every flight). Now metal fatigue IS something that can be missed very easily and it's also something which forms over time. So even if we forget that they possibly missed it during the last inspection, it's more than likely that it wasn't even an issue when it was scrutineered.

So hardly an "act of God" more Blackpool only doing what was necessary (which is not wrong, just cost effective ). Some companies with more financial clout probably check their rides and attractions thoroughly on a more regular basis, which results in fewer major incidents regarding the mechanical side of things (this doesn't account for human error of course :lol: ).

So let's not be quick to slate others because of their slight disapproval for the Pleasure Beach, it's not nice. He was merely saying that more could be done (which it can). But at the same time, Blackpool almost certainly did all that was required of them.





My God! A sensible post - I feel light headed! Nurse! NURSE!

 

[Anonymous]

The train didn't stall, part of the wheel assembly failed in a pretty bad way and caused it to come off the track. If this is a common thing to happen at PBB, then they ARE neglectful.

As was, I thought it was just a bad bit of luck, but it appears there's more to it than that if this kind of thing is a regular occurance...

Furie, you know as well as I do that people are putting 2 and 2 together and getting 5 here. You have read the same claims as I have that say its happened on the same section of track....

How many times did the Cyclone stall on the turnaround? How many times did Corkscrew stall? These things happen.

As we've said, its more than likely a case of metal fatigue.

As for 'slating Brookes,' well the fella took long enough to notice he had the ride in question on his avatar and sig. He was also rather quick to make un-founded accusations of neglect, somthing I'd really like to see some evidence of.

Ash

 

[Gavin]

How many times did the Cyclone stall on the turnaround? How many times did Corkscrew stall?

A fair few? Not sure exactly. How many times did the wheels become free from the track when that happened?

You're right; it's more than likely metal fatigue and something that couldn't be helped, but it was more than a "basic" stall. I know you feel like you have to defend Blackpool, but the same conversations/questions would be happening if something similar happened at another park. They did, in fact, just recently with the EGF incident.

 

[marc]

Ash blackpool are making your one post a year count go up lol

Gemini at cp stalled this week, all wheels still on the track. Volcano stalled the other day again all wheels in the track.

Many coasters stall but re open a few yours later, people have pictures of a wheel off a track so the big dipper was not a stall like the coasters I have mentioned.

In many cases parks cannot help it if parks break, same as when a road car breaks down tbh. What I find worrying is the fact the big dipper had problems in August so I would have thought more checks would be carried out as it's still not known if the track was broken or did the train break the track?

Also someone has said this is the same train that got stuck in August, is that true?

Please note I am not having a dig at anyone here.

 

[Scott88]

In many cases parks cannot help it if parks break, same as when a road car breaks down tbh. What I find worrying is the fact the big dipper had problems in August so I would have thought more checks would be carried out as it's still not known if the track was broken or did the train break the track?

Clearly sufficent checks were carried out otherwise H&S wouldnt of allowed them to re-open the ride at all. It was signed off as safe to run two trains by an outside company, so again it clearly was safe to run.

A big thing is being made outta this because it happened in the same place as last years crash, but the fact the media havent got involved suggests to me its nothing more than a minor incident.

Also someone has said this is the same train that got stuck in August, is that true?

Nope considering that train is in pieces, in one of the workshops at the Pleasure Beach.

 

[Ian]

A big thing is being made outta this because it happened in the same place as last years crash, but the fact the media havent got involved suggests to me its nothing more than a minor incident.

Funnily enough, The Sun newspaper called me 30mins after I tweeted it. Once I told them that there were no injuries and staff evacuated it promptly, they lost interest, lol! I also got a call from a local radio station on Monday, again, lack of injury meant lack of interest.

It still doesn't negate from the significance of it. Two incidents in 10 months on the same section of track is still a serious issue, albeit not sensationial enough to make mainstream media.

 

[ciallkennett]

Martyn H is very unhappy his picture could not not be used in The Sun

 

[Nemesis Inferno]

Clearly sufficent checks were carried out otherwise H&S wouldnt of allowed them to re-open the ride at all. It was signed off as safe to run two trains by an outside company, so again it clearly was safe to run.

Gonna be honest here, just because it passed morning inspection makes no difference to this happening, I've seen sommat happen a few hours after the ride had opened that can be deemed an extremely serious issue, but by your reckoning, because it passed the checks, it's fine...

Funnily enough, The Sun newspaper called me 30mins after I tweeted it. Once I told them that there were no injuries and staff evacuated it promptly, they lost interest, lol! I also got a call from a local radio station on Monday, again, lack of injury meant lack of interest.

And that just shows how our media works... Just because of no injuries there's feck all interest... Typical...

 

[marc]

Scott you have missed my point. My point was due to the accident in August and never really knowing what caused it you would have thought they would now carry out more checks in the day than they used to. This has nothing to do with H&S signing off the ride.

 

[Anonymous]

A fair few? Not sure exactly. How many times did the wheels become free from the track when that happened?

Gavin, (I'm not trying to be snotty here, so I hope it doesn't sound that way) but you say the word de-rail to 100 people. 99 of them will imagine the train laying in bits on the ground, or hanging from the structure with a few dead bodies littering the park.

They wont imagine *1* wheel being higher than it should be, with the train still fixed to the track. It wasn't like the tracin could be pushed off the track, even after this, as 3 out of the 4 up stop wheels were where they should be.

All I'm saying is it was slightly over-reported.

Ash

 

[Nemesis Inferno]

All I'm saying is it was slightly over-reported.

No it's not...

Let's look at the definition of the word derailed shall we?

1 : to cause to run off the rails
2 a : to obstruct the progress of : frustrate <security> b : to upset the stability or composure of
intransitive verb : to leave the rails

Over-reported my arse... If it had come off the tracks there would be a totally different reporting style surrounding it... Using the term derailed is the basic truth, regardless of what people may think...

 

[Scott88]

Gonna be honest here, just because it passed morning inspection makes no difference to this happening, I've seen sommat happen a few hours after the ride had opened that can be deemed an extremely serious issue, but by your reckoning, because it passed the checks, it's fine...

So what you are suggesting is, that they do the checks in the morning and then close the ride every few hours while they do another track walk?

Scott you have missed my point. My point was due to the accident in August and never really knowing what caused it you would have thought they would now carry out more checks in the day than they used to. This has nothing to do with H&S signing off the ride.

Again, what do you suggest? They do there morning track walk and test the ride, every day, what more can they do?

 

[nealbie]

Gonna be honest here, just because it passed morning inspection makes no difference to this happening, I've seen sommat happen a few hours after the ride had opened that can be deemed an extremely serious issue, but by your reckoning, because it passed the checks, it's fine...

So what you are suggesting is, that they do the checks in the morning and then close the ride every few hours while they do another track walk?

Scott you have missed my point. My point was due to the accident in August and never really knowing what caused it you would have thought they would now carry out more checks in the day than they used to. This has nothing to do with H&S signing off the ride.

Again, what do you suggest? They do there morning track walk and test the ride, every day, what more can they do?

In both cases Scott I refer you back to my post about metal fatigue and the National Geographic channel near the top of page 4.

What Benin and Marc are saying is that a) it can happen all of a sudden which makes morning checks obsolete and throws everything previous out of the window - because it is a new problem/issue, and b) that you would have thought due to its previous record because of the recent crash that more checks than necessary guidelines were undertaken.

It's very reasonable to suggest that if (with regards to point b) they'd decided to start daily UV checks on the metal, then this would not have happened. It's been a few months since the ride has been handed over, and metal fatigue is NOT something you can see with a quick visual check.

Hope that's helped.







Nurse?! NURSE?! It's happened again! Fetch me the fish custard!

 

[Nemesis Inferno]

Gonna be honest here, just because it passed morning inspection makes no difference to this happening, I've seen sommat happen a few hours after the ride had opened that can be deemed an extremely serious issue, but by your reckoning, because it passed the checks, it's fine...

So what you are suggesting is, that they do the checks in the morning and then close the ride every few hours while they do another track walk?

Scott you have missed my point. My point was due to the accident in August and never really knowing what caused it you would have thought they would now carry out more checks in the day than they used to. This has nothing to do with H&S signing off the ride.

Again, what do you suggest? They do there morning track walk and test the ride, every day, what more can they do?

I don't think me or marc were making any suggestions as to how to improve, just pointing out that they cannot do much else aside from the morning checks...

I personally wasn't suggesting closing rides in the middle of the day for another lengthy inspection, far from that, just saying things happen after a full clean inspection...

What could they do? Blackpool SHOULD invest more money into the maintenance side of things and they could indeed increase the length of the checks to ensure that this sort of thing should never happen again... Without knowing what they do currently makes it impossible to judge, but they should at least be starting the checks 3/4 hours before park opening...



EDIT - GODDAMIT NEAL AND YOUR NINJANESS!!!!!!

 

[nealbie]

:black:

 

[marc]

Scott what I mean is they check the trains every 2 hours or something like that. Just carry out more spot checks, I know you are going to say this will slow down the through put but I would argue that and say its better to lose maybe a train for 30 mins a day rather than a whole ride.

I am not saying they are doing anything wrong, I am just saying they could do more checks like other parks do with older rides.

 

[Anonymous]

No it's not...

Let's look at the definition of the word derailed shall we?

Merriam-Webster Dictionary wrote:
1 : to cause to run off the rails
2 a : to obstruct the progress of : frustrate <security> b : to upset the stability or composure of
intransitive verb : to leave the rails


Over-reported my arse... If it had come off the tracks there would be a totally different reporting style surrounding it... Using the term derailed is the basic truth, regardless of what people may think...

I'm not interested in the dictionary, I'm interested in what people are lead to believe. Do you, or do you not agree that to most people, the word de-rail means somthing has left the track in its entiraty?

Now I know for a fact that 3/4 of that cars upstop wheels remained the correct side of the running rail, meaning that even with a crane, that car (let alone the entire train!) couldn't have been removed from the track.

You guys make out it was sat ontop of the track!

Face facts, it was evactuated correctly, no-one was injured, noone seemed overly bothered by it at all (confused maybe) but when you take into account the local Blackpool rag (who hate PB with a passion) didn't even bother to mention it, it proves beyond all doubt that some people here are drama queens, nothing more.

Ash