Menu
What's new
By:
Filters

Cedar Point | Valravn | B&M Dive Machine

Imagining the option of an RMC is ruled out, any suggestions of a better new addition?

It must be tough for Cedar Fair to add successful new coasters to CP's already impressive line up. Other than an RMC, what else what be dramatically different to the rest of their coasters? I guess they are lacking a flyer in their line up, although it would be slightly similar to Raptor. They have a world class launched coaster, large sit down loopers, an airtime machine and more...

A Vekoma Boomerang maybe? :wink:

I don't really have much of an opinion on whether this is a good addition to the park or not tbh, just curious as to what could be better (other than RMC).
 
They need a world-class woodie. Blue Streak is fun in a non-wheel seat but it's nothing to brag about. Mean Streak is just God-awful. They need a nice GCI. It doesn't have to be record breaking, it just needs to be great. It's by far the biggest gap in their line up.
 
I think they'll go woodie next but where? MS being RMC'd would be nice but unless they use topper, it will just make it another steel. Of course, they could completely redo the layout.. but I can dream.. :)
 
mouse said:
Imagining the option of an RMC is ruled out, any suggestions of a better new addition?
Click to expand...
Also rule out a wood coaster, which doesn't seem to interest them one bit.

I think a EuroFighter/Infinity would be fun. I'm not a fan of doing a flying coaster, but I've never been on either of the two that I've heard are really good (Manta and especially Tatsu). A launched B&M sit-down (Incredible Hulk) could be cool. Mantis is a floorless, but a 7-looper with a launch could be seen as pretty different.

None of those seem like better ideas than Valvarn, though.

What they really need are an RMC of Mean Streak and a premier wood coaster, RMC or otherwise (GCI, GG, Intamin prefab).

Are dive coasters particularly popular in parks?
 
^ Griffon, Sheikra, Oblivion, etc. all seem popular in their own right, and staples in their respective parks.

I think everyone is agreed that RMC is the best option for any park these days, including Cedar Point. Cedar Fair however has yet to make any move on a new wooden coaster since Gold Striker in 2009, 6 years ago. Ghostrider at Knott's is a perfect candidate for RMC treatment, yet is only receiving general retrack and a new set of GCI Timberliners. Thunderhawk at Dorney? A new set of regular PTCs. Folks are welcome to speculate as to why Cedar Fair has remained so mum on the wooden coaster front - but Cedar Fair certainly appears focused moreso on other offerings, such as the B&M Hyper/Giga installations, Banshee, and Gatekeeper.

As to other coaster options for Cedar Point in particular, of the current 17 roller coasters at the park, 11 broke world records in height, speed, and/or inversion count in their debut. Notice a trend? It's Cedar Point's M.O., and has been since Gemini in 1978.

It could be easy to imagine for Cedar Point to go for a Flyer to round out B&M offerings. Or go for a larger Maverick-style multi-launcher from Mack. (I mean really, is it that difficult for an American park to figure out how to successfully market such a ride design?) Deep down? I'd love for an earnest pass at an S&S 4D. All of these roller coasters could be done as the tallest and fastest of their genre, and certain fit into the fold.

However, it is difficult to find a major amusement park that indeed has direct carbon copy offerings, such as two B&M inverts, two Intamin accelerators, etc. There are still other cards on the table - honestly for all amusement parks - and hardly a need to directly repeat a direct make and model.
 
^ Exactly. While Gold Striker opened in 2013, it was originally planned for construction in 2009. The hold up in construction was due to permitting issues with the city, due in large part to dispute over the parking lot, which is now shared with Levi Stadium (the new 49ers football stadium). Hence why the project actually dates back beyond 2013.
 
Hyde said:
I'd love for an earnest pass at an S&S 4D.
Click to expand...
They could have done this with GateKeeper!

If Intamin is making cars that rotate, why can't B&M? (I'm still suggesting B&M as the manufacturer because Cedar Fair seems to like them.)

The layout would have been different to take advantage of the spin, but I really like this idea (and I like GateKeeper). Spinning through the key holes was pretty cool. The seats could also rotate into the flying coaster position.

Pretzel loop
4D spinning
Key holes

Why didn't this happen?!?!?
 
There is a lot more involved than just "building" a roller coaster concept. Lots of research and development, testing, etc. All of this involves a lot cost - enough so that B&M would need to identify more than just one project to go forward. And taking a look around the world, demand for 4D roller coasters is certainly not a roaring boil.
 
It took B&M until 2015 to build their own launch because they didn't think the technology was right, and you expect them to build a 4D?!

Keep dreaming.

I feel there's something stopping them getting RMCs - if they were interested we'd be seeing Ghostrider done IMO.

With their yearly flow of B&Ms would anyone be surprised if there was an ongoing contract there which stopped them getting something major from another supplier? Cause it would make sense to me.

I don't know, I'm glad there's a chain that's still giving a steady flow of B&Ms and giving them the money to do spectacular things. Take Cedar Fair out and the only B&Ms in America from 2013-6 are Mako and Thunderbird! As much as I love RMCs there are a lot of them going up - the World needs Fury 325s as well!
 
Nothing is stopping them from getting an RMC. I think Ouimett said that he is looking at all potential fixes and will go with the right choice on a "per ride basis". I believe this came from an interview someone (LA Times maybe?) did as they were talking about Ghost Rider and its current refurb.

Also, bar Cedar Point (and even then it is only 2 additions), Cedar Fair has typically been a follower, rather than a leader, to the current ride trends. Hell, I would even go so far as to say that they have been following trends until the installments of Leviathan and Fury325. The gigas would be the closest thing to trend-setting Cedar Fair has done imo.
 
Hyde said:
There is a lot more involved than just "building" a roller coaster concept. Lots of research and development, testing, etc. All of this involves a lot cost - enough so that B&M would need to identify more than just one project to go forward. And taking a look around the world, demand for 4D roller coasters is certainly not a roaring boil.
Click to expand...
How do you know that?

I mean, there is currently only one manufacturer offering proper 4D coasters. And that is S&S, which is a manufacturer that is not very popular with any of their coaster models. I think it has more to do with price (which is not that extreme tbh, if you compare it to other coasters of a similar thrill), reliability, maintenance, smoothness and capacity (which on paper isn't that bad either). Anyone that has ridden an S&S 4D has to agree that it's a spectacular ride? And X2 is still the most popular ride at the biggest of the Six Flags parks! I really don't think popularity is the issue here. If a manufacturer (let's say B&M) perfected the 4D concept I believe every major park would want want! It really is the ultimate roller coaster, at least at the time being.
 
All someone would have to do is go to SFMM as a guest, sit outside X2 all day, and they are convinced not to get that model. It'll be 15 years old, and has been plagued with issues from day one. That thing is a mechanical nightmare.

When it initially opened, did so for 2 weeks, then was shut for 6 months. The updated trains in 2008 helped some issues, but the issues with it are substantial. Horrible capacity, extremely expensive (factor in the Reno in 2008 and the cost balloons as that was $10 million just for paint and 3 trains) and you quickly get why they are so rare.

Doesn't mean it's bad at qll, quite the opposite.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk
 
Intricks said:
Nothing is stopping them from getting an RMC. I think Ouimett said that he is looking at all potential fixes and will go with the right choice on a "per ride basis". I believe this came from an interview someone (LA Times maybe?) did as they were talking about Ghost Rider and its current refurb.
Click to expand...

You genuinely don't know that, you have no way of knowing that unless you know what contracts they have out there, which you don't.

If they had a contract, they wouldn't announce it to the World.

But, yeah, k.
 
Is Eejanaika problematic? They're not the same, but what about the free spin rides? If not, then it could just be an issue with X2 or with X2 being the first go at it.

Either way, B&M is pretty smart. I'd expect them to figure it out.
 
^^ If you are referring to a potential non-competitive agreement between Six Flags and RMC for X amount of years, it would more than likely be gone considering Storm Chaser is opening next year. If you are referring to a construction contract between CF and GCI in regards to any and all track modifications and reprofiling, I doubt it as theyve had other rides reprofiled without GCI involvment (Mean Streak, the Hurlers, Beast and Thunder Road possibly as well). Your argument against me is "You dont have proof of what you are stating, but I dont have any solid proof against it, so spaghetti monster".

^ Eejanaika, Dinoconda and X2 all have issues with the seats rocking - they dont transition smoothly during the ride and cause this odd jerking motion when rotating.
 
Intricks said:
^ Eejanaika, Dinoconda and X2 all have issues with the seats rocking - they dont transition smoothly during the ride and cause this odd jerking motion when rotating.
Click to expand...
But it's hardly the rocking that's the problem, is it? You don't even notice it while on ride.

I would be intrigued to find some statistics of Dinocondas reliability. That ride is much newer than the others, and in contradiction to Eejanaika feature the second generation trains. I would assume that S&S has adressed a lot of the previous problems with that ride!
 
I barely noticed it during the faster transitions, but it was noticeable during small changes for the seats. Watching the videos TPR has posted for Eejanaika and Dinoconda for the view of the rider shows just how bouncy the seats can be/are though. Im not saying that it is a determining factor in regards to a park buying one, but it could be another item that they tick in regards to rider comfort.

I wonder how often Eejanaika and Dinoconda are down, or if the X/X2 legacy is potentially the reason for lack of buyers. Has anyone on here gone to those parks often enough to have anything to say towards this?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top