Antinos
Slut for Spinners
Luckily for Nagashima Spaland, it seems like Morgan worked to perfect their craft and applied lessons learned with each ride they designed. Of the Morgans I've ridden, they seem to get better by opening year.
Coasters that were built too early?
- Thread starter Pokemaniac
- Start date
Rita
A few years later after Maverick maybe a multi launch LSM Intamin would have been more interesting for Alton Towers although very pricey compared to Rita I believe. Could have been higher capacity with 2 launches and obviously a much longer track. And thus maybe more of a desire to create a better theme. Maybe a Towers' ghost chase related theme or so. But more family friendly something like Ghostbusters type of stuff rather than the constant horror thing.
Maybe this could have then been rolled into a single SW coaster project rather than Rita AND Thirteen. Maybe it would have pushed the possibility of drop track and multi launch from Intamin sooner.
Edit: Just noticed that Desert Race was mentioned in the thread so basically same coaster.
A few years later after Maverick maybe a multi launch LSM Intamin would have been more interesting for Alton Towers although very pricey compared to Rita I believe. Could have been higher capacity with 2 launches and obviously a much longer track. And thus maybe more of a desire to create a better theme. Maybe a Towers' ghost chase related theme or so. But more family friendly something like Ghostbusters type of stuff rather than the constant horror thing.
Maybe this could have then been rolled into a single SW coaster project rather than Rita AND Thirteen. Maybe it would have pushed the possibility of drop track and multi launch from Intamin sooner.
Edit: Just noticed that Desert Race was mentioned in the thread so basically same coaster.
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My mind immediately went to all three of these; hallmark roller coasters with less than sterling record - be it track removal, early retirement, or destruction of a company, respectively. In looking at the IoA Intamin Blitz (and Maxx Force at SFGAm), Maverick would undoubtedly have kept it's high speed barrel roll with different heartline design, had it been built in 2020 vs. 2007.
A balance I strike in my mind is what "too early" is defined as. Much of the roller coaster industry comes from an iterative approach; a new technology or concept is introduced, with subsequent roller coaster designs further expanding/scaling the technology. So what makes a roller coaster "too early", versus a proof of concept, built with the intent of building better, more advanced coasters of the same style down the road? E.g. Intamin Mega coasters, evolving into Gigas (And also definitely agree with @nadroJ that Arrow/S&S 4D is still being perfected
)I would argue that the Vekoma Flying Dutchmen was too early in it's opening. Absolutely a proof of concept with super forward thinking design and ride style; however Vekoma totally missed the mark on rider comfort and ease of use, which really hampers the ride experience. B&M Flyers are far more comfortable, but also feel more, fly-y? Or at least spend proportionally more time face down than face up, lending themselves to the experience of flight. And at least as Vekoma appears to try to reinvent the concept, they still appear to be finding their niche application and pivot.
Matt N
CF Legend
Sorry to bump this thread, but in hindsight, I think Takabisha at Fuji-Q Highland would have benefitted from being built a little bit later.
I’ve never ridden, but it looks like it would definitely have benefited from being an Infinity Coaster instead of a Euro-Fighter. I imagine it could have been absolutely spectacular with the lap bar trains and Gerstlauer’s much improved track profiling that can be found on the newer Infinity Coasters, what with its seemingly very graceful, hangtime-focused layout, but at the time, Fuji-Q were stuck with the Euro-Fighter design, which was intended for much simpler, more compact coasters built at much smaller parks. As such, while I’m sure Takabisha is still a great ride, it feels a little out of step with the rest of Gerstlauer’s Euro-Fighter arsenal, and I’ve always felt that the ride would have been far more at home within the Infinity Coaster lineup.
I’ve never ridden, but it looks like it would definitely have benefited from being an Infinity Coaster instead of a Euro-Fighter. I imagine it could have been absolutely spectacular with the lap bar trains and Gerstlauer’s much improved track profiling that can be found on the newer Infinity Coasters, what with its seemingly very graceful, hangtime-focused layout, but at the time, Fuji-Q were stuck with the Euro-Fighter design, which was intended for much simpler, more compact coasters built at much smaller parks. As such, while I’m sure Takabisha is still a great ride, it feels a little out of step with the rest of Gerstlauer’s Euro-Fighter arsenal, and I’ve always felt that the ride would have been far more at home within the Infinity Coaster lineup.
It has just occurred to me that the term "paradigm shift" was what I was looking for this whole time. All this time, we've been talking about coasters built right before the paradigm shifted and somebody either found a better way to pull off the same concept, or realized the concept was rubbish and scrapped it entirely, in both cases leaving the park with a somewhat underwhelming purchase.
Unfortunately, I don't have a good nomination to come with the revelation, but Coaster Express at Parque Warner Madrid will have to do. It's the last woodie built by RCCA before they went bankrupt, built just as GCI were stepping up their game, and just as its parent design company Intamin was starting to implement the Plug'n'Play woodies. It's built a year before Balder, and two years after the acclaimed Lightning Racer, but apparently rides like a washing machine with a brick in it. Coaster Express was built just as people started expecting woodies to be either a little less rough or a little more thrilling, unfortunately, Coaster Express appears to be neither.
Unfortunately, I don't have a good nomination to come with the revelation, but Coaster Express at Parque Warner Madrid will have to do. It's the last woodie built by RCCA before they went bankrupt, built just as GCI were stepping up their game, and just as its parent design company Intamin was starting to implement the Plug'n'Play woodies. It's built a year before Balder, and two years after the acclaimed Lightning Racer, but apparently rides like a washing machine with a brick in it. Coaster Express was built just as people started expecting woodies to be either a little less rough or a little more thrilling, unfortunately, Coaster Express appears to be neither.
When I watched the POV of Hagrid's Magical Creatures my first thought was of Expedition Everest. That pause at the broken track section was ambitious but now it can be done so seamlessly, it seems a shame they didn't wait for technology to catch up with their ambitions.
Will
Strata Poster
I still didn't find it all that rough, but it IS incredibly boring. Endless rambling helices do little for me and the idea that it could've been an Intamin or a GCI instead has made me a little sad!
Matt N
CF Legend
Ooh, I’d definitely agree with Everest. I’ve always felt like that stop in the middle really kills the flow; you sit there for what feels like ages while the track switches, and after a bit of time, you’ve ascertained that there’s only really one direction the train can travel in. By comparison, your aforementioned example of Hagrid’s built in 2019, and even rides like Thirteen built in 2010, execute this trick far more slickly.
However, I get that it was innovative at the time, so I think it deserves applause for that.
CanobieFan
Strata Poster
Snip snip....
This, basically. I was honestly disappointed when I found out Ninja Turtles at Nick Universe was going to still have shoulder restraint, although I believe it was addressed in a topic for that ride/park... either here or elsewhere...but I did see something where Gerstlauer said they were unable to to do the lapbar trains on a ride that both launched and had a lift hill... and maybe the hold before the drop? But there was too much going on on the underside of the car for lapbars.... which would have greatly increased the experience for TMNT, while not rough, did have one VERY pronounced head bang every single time I rode it no matter how I tried to avoid it.
And Big Grizzly Mountain in 2012. The backwards section isn't anywhere near as good as Everest's, but the change in direction is executed so much better.
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HeartlineCoaster
Theme Park Superhero
Never thought about it from a physical perspective like that before, always assumed it was health and safety getting in the way.
Damnit Gerstlauer, try harder!
Matt N
CF Legend
Sorry to bump this thread, but reading a recent Florida trip report by @Serena gave me a new idea for this thread; I actually think Hollywood Rip Ride Rockit at Universal Studios Florida is a good shout for this one.
On paper, it has (or at least attempts) a lot of what people seem to like in some of the current modern heavyweights; lap bar restraints, wacky elements, and lots of little hops and dynamic transitions being among these traits. If you think about it, HRRR sort of attempted an RMC-style wacky layout filled with wacky elements before RMC even built their first coaster. I know that probably sounds nuts, but HRRR did trial some really wacky elements and a generally quite unconventional layout style that could be construed as an RMC-style ride before they were really a thing; elements like the non-inverted loop, the wave turn-style thing, the inclined loop and the little pops of airtime in places certainly aren't what I'd call conventional.
However, the end product wasn't that well received, as I don't think the tech to fully do the concept justice was quite there in 2009. I imagine that if a manufacturer like Intamin, RMC, Gerstlauer, Mack, Vekoma or many others had attempted the concept of HRRR a few years later, then it would have been a vastly more highly received ride. Even as someone who personally quite liked HRRR last time I rode, I'll admit that I think it would have been more highly received had it been built a few years later.
On paper, it has (or at least attempts) a lot of what people seem to like in some of the current modern heavyweights; lap bar restraints, wacky elements, and lots of little hops and dynamic transitions being among these traits. If you think about it, HRRR sort of attempted an RMC-style wacky layout filled with wacky elements before RMC even built their first coaster. I know that probably sounds nuts, but HRRR did trial some really wacky elements and a generally quite unconventional layout style that could be construed as an RMC-style ride before they were really a thing; elements like the non-inverted loop, the wave turn-style thing, the inclined loop and the little pops of airtime in places certainly aren't what I'd call conventional.
However, the end product wasn't that well received, as I don't think the tech to fully do the concept justice was quite there in 2009. I imagine that if a manufacturer like Intamin, RMC, Gerstlauer, Mack, Vekoma or many others had attempted the concept of HRRR a few years later, then it would have been a vastly more highly received ride. Even as someone who personally quite liked HRRR last time I rode, I'll admit that I think it would have been more highly received had it been built a few years later.
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Indy
Hyper Poster
I would argue that HRRR wasn't built too early; it was simply built by the wrong company or built too early for that company. There was nothing radical about the design. The non-inverting loop was certainly new, but that is easily the best executed portion of the coaster. Regardless, the elements aren't terribly innovative. Fahrenheit was built the year before and is similar in nature, but a vastly superior product. Given that Intamin had created elements such as the flying snake dive in 2004 and the Norwegian loop in 2006, it's not farfetched that they could have easily developed the same element if they had thought about it.
Additionally, HRRR was essentially just supposed to be a US version of Hollywood Dream; a big ride that plays music. The technology was all there for perfect execution of what the park was going for. They just opted for a manufacturer who did not have much experience building rides of that size and nature. I don't think Intamin or B&M would have needed any additional time to execute the ride correctly. Given that Mack put out Blue Fire the same year, I'd argue that they probably didn't really need any more time either. Maurer arguably needed more time though.
All of the being said, despite that fact that it doesn't have great reviews amongst goons, it's still a very popular ride at the park.
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Schwarzkopf Shuttle-Loop
Anton at first envisioned this type of coaster to have a LSM launch but he could find no one to build the LSM-engines up to his specs. He then switched to flywheel launch - and even that didn't work out for the first orders so improvised the weight drop launch.
Anton at first envisioned this type of coaster to have a LSM launch but he could find no one to build the LSM-engines up to his specs. He then switched to flywheel launch - and even that didn't work out for the first orders so improvised the weight drop launch.
SkyrushSimp
Mega Poster
Hypersonic XLC was a good concept but the airlaunch wasn't good for maintenence at the time.
Sandman
Giga Poster
Bit of a weird one I suppose but Blue Fire?
From one perspective, Blue Fire has actually had an incredible impact on the industry. Almost 13 years old already, Mack's first foray into launch coasters... and look what they have given us since then.
However, if Blue Fire was built today, I'm sure we'd see a custom layout with 2/3 launches. Perhaps it could have been a bit more of a contender in Europe or even Germany instead of debatably the first/second/third (take your pick) best coaster in the park.
From one perspective, Blue Fire has actually had an incredible impact on the industry. Almost 13 years old already, Mack's first foray into launch coasters... and look what they have given us since then.
However, if Blue Fire was built today, I'm sure we'd see a custom layout with 2/3 launches. Perhaps it could have been a bit more of a contender in Europe or even Germany instead of debatably the first/second/third (take your pick) best coaster in the park.
Steely Dan
Mega Poster
as a counterpoint to the "too early" coaster, i submit an "ahead of its time" coaster.
this ride was the very first ever of its kind in the world. it was seen as revolutionary in coasterdom.
and it put its manufacturer on the map as THE top coaster builder in the world at the time.
later iterations of the type got bigger and faster and longer and loopier, to be sure, but this very first ever prototype example held up extremely well (and still does, IMO), so much so that is was cloned a further 11 times over the following decade.
that roller coaster is: Batman: The Ride, built in 1992 at SFGAm, the world's very first ever inverted rollercoaster.
what a smashing success for the type right out of the gate! a home run on the first pitch!
Hah if anything, Blue Fire was built at the right time, just built by the wrong company. The contest between Arrow and B&M between Drachen Fire and Kuma is pretty well documented, as well as how horridly Arrow executed with the more aggressive layout.
Funny, would've sworn you were about to say the Vekoma Boomerang.
Don't sell inverts and Batman short - it's quick commercial success not only meant clone after clone, but quick proliferation into custom designs - Batman opened in 92, but was quickly followed by Nemesis and Raptor in 94, further proving how versatile the invert system was.
But your mentioning of B&M makes me now wonder - was the Giovanola hyper ahead of it's time? I'll be the first to admit that Goliath and Titan are actually quite decent rides. Sure they're trimmed to death and don't have as many airtime hills - but modern B&M Hypers have a lot of the same elements (including, dare I say, mercilessless trims
) and box track design that was developed. It's only a hop, skip, and a jump that get us to present day.
Sandman
Giga Poster
I agree to an extent, in the context of the wider industry. It's just unfortunate that EP had to be lumbered with the pilot version. Mack can do so much more with their launch coaster, I still don't think we've seen the full potential (Helix being the benchmark for almost a decade now).