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Dreamland Margate News

Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

Martyn B said:
Oh... geek alert! I hope each ride has a little sign by the entrance detailing when it was built, who by, and the history of the ride (where it has been before etc). :D
I'll be amazed if they don't. Seeing as the whole point of the park is to celebrate it's history, and that of the rides, they'd be daft not to.
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

Martyn B said:
For example the 1960's Meteorite ride will probably be themed to a 50s retro space theme

Is that the Waveswinger from Loudoun Castle, that used to be at Dreamland before?

Oh... geek alert! I hope each ride has a little sign by the entrance detailing when it was built, who by, and the history of the ride (where it has been before etc). :D
Afraid not Martyn. :( Sorry I should have made that a bit clearer in the post, as the two rides have identical names. But no, the Meteorite I am talking about is one of those old cage rides which use centrifugal force to stick you to the outside as they rotate. (though it is in a bad condition having been located in a dome at BPB for a few decades)

The Loudoun Meteorite, that you are talking about-The Plough is sadly still deteriorating in Scotland. It could still be easily restored though it is missing some of its metal casing. It is hard to tell if it has just been fallen off, or if people have just stole it and sold it on for scrap metal. Either way it is a unique, classic attraction that has a direct historical link with Dreamland, thus making it perfect for the Heritage Park.

To answer your final question. From all the plans and proposals I have read, that is exactly right. Each ride will have a board of facts about the ride, a bit of history from where the ride originated from and a few boards in the queueline that will have people's past memories on. When complete, it should look rather lovely. It should make the park alot more unique.
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

I know what ride you mean now, Loudoun had one of them too (The Milk Churn). :lol:
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

I love those meteorite things! There's a travelling one that comes to near me for the local towns carinval and it's brilliant.
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

The BBC are back at reporting about this park. A new design team have been hired to create the new look for the park. Which is odd because I thought they had the design of everything finished years ago back when they first approached the idea?

Meh, means they're back in the public eye and they've announced a 2014 opening date...


Wayne Hemingway has been announced as the designer for the revival of a historic theme park in Kent.

Mr Hemingway, his wife Gerardine, and the HemingwayDesign team will create the overall scheme and branding for the disused Dreamland site in Margate.

It is hoped that stage one of the project to turn the site into a £10m heritage park will open in 2014.

Mr Hemingway said he was "excited about bringing a new vibrant life to an iconic British seaside institution".

"Having visited Margate over the past few months and seen the grassroots creative revolution that is taking place, we are thrilled, nay cock a hoop, at the potential of the place and can't wait to get stuck in," he said.

"We fully understand the scale of the task but with the creative community of Margate and environs we can deliver something of international significance."

'Genuine passion'
The park will be run by the Dreamland Trust, which will be given the site by Thanet District Council for a peppercorn rent.

Chairman Nick Laister said he had no doubt HemingwayDesign would bring the trust's proposals for the site to life, exceeding its expectations.

"Wayne and Gerardine and their team have a genuine passion for the British seaside and for the Dreamland Margate project," he said.

"I am delighted to welcome them on to our team."

The heritage amusement park is seen as vital in the regeneration of Margate, along with the Turner Contemporary art gallery which opened further along the seafront last year.

Link to article
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

There's an official statement on their site about the project now: http://www.hemingwaydesign.co.uk/projec ... nd-margate

I can never decide whether I like Wayne Hemingway or not. The fact that he goes to great pains to be quintessentially British is a major plus in my book, and is essential for a project like this. Sometimes he (and his designs) come across as really down to earth and "everyday", then he'll go and do something that just comes across as completely pretentious and unrealistic. Hopefully this project will help me make my mind up, and hopefully it'll be positive!
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

I am genuinely so excited for this! <3

Can we have a new title now? Something like "Dreamland to reopen"?
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

Until the appeal hearing against the CPO is over and done with and lost, no.
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

Let's hope "Dreamland" can open as promised, would be lovely to ride the Scenic railway again not done since the 80's. :--D
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

Until they actually start work I won't believe any things going to happen, just heard it all too many times now.
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

In another topic

marc said:
They want to be careful though as the park closed down for a reason in the 1st place. Getting all the old rides back is ok for a year or two but what happens in year 5 or 6?

Really do want them to do well but I just fear there will not be enough to make people want to go back again and again.

Which is a really interesting point of discussion but not just relevant to the attraction that was being spoken about so I thought I would bring it here...

To be fair the park though the park didn't close down because of the old rides being there though. It closed down because the person running it wanted it to go down hill, removing attractions and offering less each year so people stopped going. It was the removal of rides that was the issue, not the lack of new ones. (At least initially)

The reason I think this will work is that it will be treated as heritage site rather than a traditional theme park. The way in which they will keep repeat trade is by having rolling exhibitions which change every few months. Just think of it like an open-air museum. I don't think they are particularly aiming for the thrill seeking, theme park going crowd. Everything about this project screams heritage site so it's not a far jump to believe this will marketed towards the people that like visiting Heritage Sites/Museums/National Trust Properties. I.e not necessarily the same crowd as every other theme park and therefore the business model has to be approached from a totally different angle. A normal theme park has to add new, inventive and current attractions to stay in 'fashion'. they have to be seen to be competitive in which technology they are using and making sure it is at the top of their game. Dreamland does not have this constraint because it is so steeped in the past.

Look at places like Longleat, sure they have expanded a little in the last few years but in general it hasn't changed that much and yet people still going and repeat business is good for them too. Stone Henge is another. I daresay nothing has changed about that place in god knows how many years. What can they change or add? Do they even need to? Nope. I can hear people saying that an Amusement Park is nothing like a place like Stone Henge though. Of course, on the surface they are totally different and I agree but that because that is how we percieve it to be. We are expecting this to be like every other Amusement/Theme park but it simply will not. This will be a heritage site depicting an era of British history just as Stone Henge does. It is difficult, but you have to make a clear distinction between the two. In fact, I wouldnt be surprised if English Heritage were heavily involved anyways, considering their involvement with listing the Scenic Railway (and thereby confirming that the site is of historical importance)

In terms of moving forward, most museums are lucky to get many new additions if any at all so they make do with temporary exhibitions to draw loyally returning visitor bases. That could be achieved solely in a 'local' sense. Obviously their net of local will be a little wider. I daresay this will be a rather pricy 'Local' Museum to run but how many other local museums have the potential of a whole country of people that may have visited Margate as their seaside/holiday destination in the past.

Bear in mind that there are all sorts of bizarre, unusual historical sites and museums out there. Museums that feature the strangest of historical timelines in the sense they exhibit a history of an item that we might consider unnoteworthy. I daresay that some people out there think the idea of a Transport Museum or a museum of clocks are the single dullest ideas ever whereas others are fascinated by the insight it gives us into a Britain gone-by. Think of sites like the 'Secret' Nuclear Bunker in Brentwood, Essex. As little or 'local' as it is, it still ticks over because it still gets visited. It doesnt need bells and whistles and brand new attractions because that is not what it is about.

Dreamland will be the same. It will not need the brand new attractions because that is not what the modus operandi will be. Sure, they will probably pick up 'new' attractions in the sense of ones that are now old throughout the rest of the industry but in general they will survive quite happily on the crowds of people that will visit fascinated by the way in which Brits used to enjoy their holidays/days out.

Personally I LOVE the idea of visiting that history of British holidaymaking coupled with the history of another of my great loves, rides. I wouldn't half mind a job there!

EDIT - I have just realised that this is probably a bit off topic despite being inspired by the original post so I will put this in the actual Dreamland topic too for those who want to continue the discussion.
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

Museums are growing in popularity at the moment, because most of them are... FREE!

THIS is the problem Dreamland will face as a "museum". People will only go en mass, and thus spend their hard earned pennies, if they associate the place with being free. Having no entrance fee will not be enough, because people associate these spaces (amusements, be that rides, arcades, etc) as being high cost. Despite the extortionate cost of say, the science or natural history museum's temporary exhibitions, food and merchandise, people associate them with being good value days out.

I'm skeptical that Dreamland could convince people of its museological qualities, whilst holding their interest with amusements. The balancing act is impossible, I fear.

And I bet they WON'T have temporary exhibitions. That's what they should do, but they won't.

Sent from my HTC Wildfire S A510e using Tapatalk 2
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

Well, according to the November Newsletter they have already started planning out the exhibitions and events as well as allocating a space for travelling showmen to bring attractions in too.

I do worry about the free aspect too, however, I remember a time when very few were free.

Any fees that they charge will depend very much on how much financial support elsewhere tbh.
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

Unfortunately there was many reasons why Dreamland went down. Many reasons already mentioned.
I don't know how many of you went to the park in its gloom years, but it was nothing like its former self. No vegetation or landscaping, the rides were okay at best (with few exceptions) and the whole place just didn't look particularly appealing. I don't blame people when they stopped visiting. It was a wasteland.

Though I don't know all the details, the second reason for its closure was after a girl died at the Rotunda park, Jimmy decided it was a good time to pack up shop and move away from the amusement park side of things. This is also linked into the fact that he wanted to make Dreamland's redevelopment part of his retirement plan.

So yes, Dreamland did close due to lack of popularity, but even in its final years, it was still in the top five most popular UK tourist attractions.

The issue is. Alot has changes since then. New parks have been developed such as Thorpe and Legoland, and now own the amusement park popularity crown.
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

^Indeed, which is why I feel that that this won't be marketed as just another amusement park but as a Heritage Site giving people the opportunity to relive a part of Britains history. They would be daft to go into direct competition with modern amusement parks so if they become something totally different they have a fighting chance and wont be competiting with anyone.
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

I think people are forgetting the location of the park too. From what I remember, Margate is a pretty run down little seaside town that is actually MILES from anywhere. I always thought the park died because the town around it died, just like many other similar resorts. These kind of towns are ten a penny really.

I obviously want it to work but I'm not sure if it actually will to be honest. I can't see people actually bothering to travel there just for a few old rides. This kind of attraction relies on passing trade, and if nobody is holidaying in Margate, which they probably aren't anymore, it's not going to do very well.

If it does eventually happen I'll be surprised if it stays open for longer than a couple of years.
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

The town's decline probably sure has something to do with it. If Margate had been ever growingly popular in the early 2000's, I' am sure the future of Dreamland may have been somewhat brighter.
Despite this, I still stick by my previous reasons as to why the park was closed.

We must remember that though the town is still far from perfect, it is showing signs of improvements. Weather it is the Turner or the new sea defenses. Margate is slowly starting to change its image around. It just needs that little more investment to get the ball rolling again.

As for the target market, I have to agree with Mark. Sure they could brand themselves as a new amusement park, but I don't think they will have much luck in drawing as many people in. Making it more of a heritage site in the style of Chatham dockyards or the dingles heritage centre will be a better route to go down in my opinion. These kind of attractions are surprisingly popular, and I predict new Dreamland will be the same.
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

Thats just it though Jake it was largely the opposite way around. The major decline in Margate really took hold alongside the decline of Dreamland. One didn't happen without the other. Many people visited Margate for the beach, but those are all over the place. What gave Margate the edge was having Dreamland as something to do, much like Blackpool in the North. When the Ben Bom brothers sold up to Godden everything was still running very well. As LG95 mentioned, the park was still very much nationally competitive. However, Godden had other ideas for his retirement nest egg, given that the land is far FAR more valuable as residential property than it is as leisure attraction. He had already done the same elsewhere. And so began the decline of the park. Attractions being removed and not replaced, the park getting smaller and smaller and so on.

In turn this caused a massive decline in the number of visitors to Margate on the whole. People would have opted for places like Brighton instead because it is another area that isn't just a beach. This had a knock on effect when you consider the number of businesses that would have relied on the beach trade. The typical tourist stores and so on that lined the seafront, the small hotels/BnBs/restaurants/bars all began struggling without the business. Unfortunately, local resident trade couldnt support all of those business and so on and so multiple closures occured.

So yes, Margate is now a run down little seaside town and a major contributing factor to that was the decline and closure of Dreamland. As mentioned, at one point it was actually sitting as the 3rd most succesful behind Alton and Blackpool, despite having Brighton, Chessington and Thorpe down the road, so it certainly was very popular despite being miles away. I think that was part of the charm to be honest, you always felt like you were getting away from everyday life when you went to Margate.

Apparently, the British seaside is currently enjoying a ressurgence with visitor numbers much higher than ever, which is certainly the case in Southend. Margate is also benefiting from this and the regeneration that has been going on, starting with the Turner Gallery which has actually been used as a model for success in other seaside towns, again, Southend being one of them in pushing forward for a seafront Museum & Gallery.

I think in this case it will very much be a case of build it and they will come. Will visitor numbers ever be as high as they were back in the height of Dreamland? I don't think they will, but that doesnt mean a steady stream wont keep the place going coupled with the numerous charitable donations that will be made. Much like any heritage site it will recieve many contributions from various sources.

You know me, I am normally quite the cynic but actually, I really think this could work if done right and by the looks of things they certainly seemed to be planned that way.
 
Re: Scenic Railway in Margate news

Is it worth mentioning that Thanet District Council have manged to get the CPO (appeal) hearing prioritised.
It is currently scheduled for the end of March next year. Hopefully no changes are made to delay it further.

http://dreamlandmargate.wordpress.com/
 
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