If you count coasters, what is your most tenuous counted roller coaster?

[Matt N]

Hi guys. Many of us on here count coasters, and in many cases, there’s little doubt or disagreement about whether a ride counts as a coaster or not. For instance, most enthusiasts who’ve visited Alton Towers would count Nemesis, The Smiler or Wicker Man as roller coasters, and most wouldn’t count the likes of Hex or Marauder’s Mayhem. But sometimes, there are some slightly greyer areas. Those rides that some count as coasters and some don’t. Those random water rides with coaster track, coasting sections or both, or those old-school dark rides with brief down and up dips. These types of questions mean that the best answer to the question “What is a roller coaster?” is “It’s complicated…”, in my view. There are some “Is it a cred?” conundrums that enthusiasts have been debating for years, and I doubt that there will ever be a true consensus on these. These conundrums mean that we still can’t agree on a truly concrete definition of a roller coaster. With this in mind, I’d be interested to know; if you count coasters, what is your most tenuous counted roller coaster? What is that ride that lingers within your coaster count that you’ve never been quite sure on, or that ride that you count and plenty of others don’t.

Personally, I’ve got a few possible candidates within my count of 111.

A potentially tenuous counted roller coaster of mine is Atlantica SuperSplash at Europa Park, which probably feels the least coaster-y of the coasters I’ve done and often seems to crop up in these discussions. With SuperSplash at Plopsaland and Aktium at Cinecitta World not being on RCDB despite being the same ride model as Atlantica, Atlantica’s status as a cred is up for debate in the minds of some.

Another one might be RC Racer at Walt Disney Studios in Paris, as even though RCDB counts it, I can see why some might call it more of a flat ride than a coaster. I don’t really remember the technical specifics of the ride system seeing as I last rode it 13 years ago, when I was not quite 8 years old, but from everything I’ve seen and from what I remember of it, I’d consider it a coaster, as it did seem to “coast” in sections. I also count it because RCDB counts it, and Duane is likely more clued up on the technical specifics than I am.

I’ve also always been slightly unsure with regard to some rides with small coaster sections that mostly fulfil a different function. Some might say that Arthur at Europa Park is arguably a slightly tenuous one, and I’m also thinking of things like Journey to Atlantis at SeaWorld Orlando and Harry Potter and the Escape from Gringotts at Universal Studios Florida. To be fair, most consider these rides coasters, and I would say that there’s enough uniquely “coaster-y” stuff in all of them for me to count them, but I did see one person who didn’t count them on the basis of them “not being best described as coasters”.

To be honest, though, I mostly tend to defer to RCDB on these matters. If RCDB counts it, I’m mostly happy to count it, although there are a few exceptions to that.

But I’d be interested to know; if you count coasters, what is your most tenuous counted roller coaster?

 

[Rob Coasters]

To me, Ghost Train at Blackpool Pleasure Beach always stuck out to me as "it fits the criteria to be a roller coaster but I've never counted it personally". I could, and rcdb even has a little note about this ride.
I do feel confident with counting powered coasters and water coasters like the two SuperSplashes though, but something like Arthur will be an interesting one when I come across it.

 

[JoshC.]

Dragon Gliders at Motiongate.

Calling those Mack suspended things coasters is the biggest stretch imaginable. They're a dark ride. They don't even really feel like a coaster. But I guess we're at where we are at.

If something like Dragon Gliders is a cred, then Droomvulcht at Efteling definitely should be classed as a cred. I've long thought this (albeit in a more jokey way), and frankly the only reason I haven't put it in my cred count is because it'll screw up my milestones. Not that that matters anyway, but I just don't want that annoyance.

 

[Nicky Borrill]

Dragon Gliders at Motiongate.

Calling those Mack suspended things coasters is the biggest stretch imaginable. They're a dark ride. They don't even really feel like a coaster. But I guess we're at where we are at.

If something like Dragon Gliders is a cred, then Droomvulcht at Efteling definitely should be classed as a cred. I've long thought this (albeit in a more jokey way), and frankly the only reason I haven't put it in my cred count is because it'll screw up my milestones. Not that that matters anyway, but I just don't want that annoyance.

Isn't that the same type as Arthur? If you count powered coasters at all, then Arthur is definitely a coaster, it has a great little outdoor coaster layout. But if it was just the indoor sections then I'd be inclined to agree.

I can't think of a good reason why Droomvlucht is not a coaster but Arthur is... And believe me I've tried, because Droomvlucht just doesn't feel like a coaster... But I can't give you a good reason as to why my mind differentiates the two.

I think powered coasters in general are my most tenuous ones. I'm also tempted to count Disk-Os for the same reason. The more I look at their chassis under that disk, and feel the way the power drops as you reach the top of the incline each side, the more I think they're just powered spinning shuttle coasters, especially the ones with the little hill. But I haven't 'actually' counted them yet. If I'm going to count powered coasters, I have to count Disk-Os though, right?

The Ghost Train is a coaster, has a lift hill, gravity drop, tracks, upstop wheels... I haven't counted it though... Maybe I will if I ever need a +1 to shuffle a great coaster into a milestone spot... Hey @emoo ?

 

[emoo]

there’s little doubt or disagreement about whether a ride counts as a coaster or not.

Oh there sure is loads of discrepancies, don't worry about it! It's been discussed before where the common reference points like RCDB differ to individuals because there's loads of ways to consider things. It's very hard to be consistent and sometimes the heart battles the head with no clear winner. There's so many possible variations and in some cases I find its a feel of the thing.


Devils Den @ Conneaut Lake Park 1968 to 2019
Single cars using old school ghost train track tech. The ride went up a chain lift hill followed by a blackpool ghost train style dip then downhill freerolling wild mouse style switchback's. Someone had to physically stop the rides momentum at the end, combined with a jump scare AHHHH.
RCDB doesn't consider a coaster but makes reference calling it a Pretzel Dark Ride. C-C lets you mark as an undefnied ghost train coaster.

Slope Shooter @ Higashiyama Zoo and Botanical Gardens since 1961
Single cars with tire wheels, bit like a homemade go kart with no motor. The ride goes up a lift hill followed by downhill freerolling wild mouse style switchback's down a concrete path with guide walls. Like the bobsled coasters in a way but slower and not as fun as hoped beyond the historical and novelty factors.
RCDB has this listed as a slide friction coaster

Across Amazon @ Victory Kingdom 2012 to 2015
Single boats in a water chute layout with a dip like the larger SuperSplash Mack rides but no turntables. Roles down and back up a small dip before the main splash.
RCDB has this listed

if I ever need a +1 to shuffle a great coaster into a milestone spot...

It's as if he knows I did some shuffling and rewriting history of my own to perfectly reach a milestone. I took the 3 above out of my count so I could say Nemesis Reborn was my 1,000 - wooooooo. Logically I had to count Hulk and Do-Dodonpa twice as well and these are all questionable themselves. I had the Mack Super Splashes Matt mentioned on standby if needed but I've never doubted they are coasters before.

I also took out all powered coasters for the occasion. When Pluto was taken away as a planet it was a shame but I understood the logic and classification. Coming to terms with powered coasters not actually coasting has been harder to take on board even if I can see it making sense. You can reason that going downhill its a bit faster as the motors are not struggling and it almost runs away with itself. A few powered are more sketchy such as Go-Gators where typically the train is on the highest and lowest points at all time so no coasting reasonably occurs.


All the Dragon coasters at Legoland parks are both dark ride and coaster so I'm all for it. (Even if the Windsor one its so minimal at the end I wondered where was the rest of it long before I got bogged down in this thought process). Dragon Gliders and Arthur start with a dark ride ending with a coaster section going over an area. The difference here is they are powered so they get judged on that and they count to me. Jurassic Flyers is also one to consider, if anyone's been on all 3 I'd be interest to hear a comparison. Droomvlucht is a dark ride all the way through with a controlled helix at the end round a scene and for no meaty reason I can give I never counted this as a powered coaster.


This one has some fun details to consider:

Tyrolean Tubtwist @ Joyland Childrens Fun Park since 1950
Single cars that spin, rolling along a concrete path with guide walls and running on flat metal rails to provide power to the cars motor.
RCDB has this listed as a Side Friction, mentions its powered and also comments about the brief moments where it actually coasts. I count as powered for no explainable reason and have been on fair ground ghost trains I don't count that truly coast more.


Casey Jr. Circus Train at Disneyland Anaheim is an actual train ride (not the one going round the perimeter) that has a lift hill that possibly coasts down the rest of the track. It's as as much of a coaster as the most tenuous examples here although I'd be surprised if anyone counts it. Disneyland Paris has a powered rollercoaster with a similar name which is where this thought came from.




. Unlike the Disyleynad Paris ride with a simpversion which is a





The iginiinal I have never counted the Train ride at Disneyland Casey Jr. Circus Train

 

[Nicky Borrill]

Oh there sure is loads of discrepancies, don't worry about it! It's been discussed before where the common reference points like RCDB differ to individuals because there's loads of ways to consider things. It's very hard to be consistent and sometimes the heart battles the head with no clear winner. There's so many possible variations and in some cases I find its a feel of the thing.


Devils Den @ Conneaut Lake Park 1968 to 2019
Single cars using old school ghost train track tech. The ride went up a chain lift hill followed by a blackpool ghost train style dip then downhill freerolling wild mouse style switchback's. Someone had to physically stop the rides momentum at the end, combined with a jump scare AHHHH.
RCDB doesn't consider a coaster but makes reference calling it a Pretzel Dark Ride. C-C lets you mark as an undefnied ghost train coaster.

Slope Shooter @ Higashiyama Zoo and Botanical Gardens since 1961
Single cars with tire wheels, bit like a homemade go kart with no motor. The ride goes up a lift hill followed by downhill freerolling wild mouse style switchback's down a concrete path with guide walls. Like the bobsled coasters in a way but slower and not as fun as hoped beyond the historical and novelty factors.
RCDB has this listed as a slide friction coaster

Across Amazon @ Victory Kingdom 2012 to 2015
Single boats in a water chute layout with a dip like the larger SuperSplash Mack rides but no turntables. Roles down and back up a small dip before the main splash.
RCDB has this listed



It's as if he knows I did some shuffling and rewriting history of my own to perfectly reach a milestone. I took the 3 above out of my count so I could say Nemesis Reborn was my 1,000 - wooooooo. Logically I had to count Hulk and Do-Dodonpa twice as well and these are all questionable themselves. I had the Mack Super Splashes Matt mentioned on standby if needed but I've never doubted they are coasters before.

I also took out all powered coasters for the occasion. When Pluto was taken away as a planet it was a shame but I understood the logic and classification. Coming to terms with powered coasters not actually coasting has been harder to take on board even if I can see it making sense. You can reason that going downhill its a bit faster as the motors are not struggling and it almost runs away with itself. A few powered are more sketchy such as Go-Gators where typically the train is on the highest and lowest points at all time so no coasting reasonably occurs.


All the Dragon coasters at Legoland parks are both dark ride and coaster so I'm all for it. (Even if the Windsor one its so minimal at the end I wondered where was the rest of it long before I got bogged down in this thought process). Dragon Gliders and Arthur start with a dark ride ending with a coaster section going over an area. The difference here is they are powered so they get judged on that and they count to me. Jurassic Flyers is also one to consider, if anyone's been on all 3 I'd be interest to hear a comparison. Droomvlucht is a dark ride all the way through with a controlled helix at the end round a scene and for no meaty reason I can give I never counted this as a powered coaster.


This one has some fun details to consider:

Tyrolean Tubtwist @ Joyland Childrens Fun Park since 1950
Single cars that spin, rolling along a concrete path with guide walls and running on flat metal rails to provide power to the cars motor.
RCDB has this listed as a Side Friction, mentions its powered and also comments about the brief moments where it actually coasts. I count as powered for no explainable reason and have been on fair ground ghost trains I don't count that truly coast more.


Casey Jr. Circus Train at Disneyland Anaheim is an actual train ride (not the one going round the perimeter) that has a lift hill that possibly coasts down the rest of the track. It's as as much of a coaster as the most tenuous examples here although I'd be surprised if anyone counts it. Disneyland Paris has a powered rollercoaster with a similar name which is where this thought came from.




. Unlike the Disyleynad Paris ride with a simpversion which is a





The iginiinal I have never counted the Train ride at Disneyland Casey Jr. Circus Train

Don’t worry Ben, I was part joking, part just trying to get your attention, as I knew you’d love the subject.

FWIW, I’d do exactly the same in your shoes.

 

[Matt N]

I’ve never removed creds from my count to “engineer” a specific milestone in that manner.

However, I did change my counting methodology last year and scrap the strange “enthusiasm start date” that I’d had up to that point to only count things I’d done after “becoming an enthusiast”. In July 2023, I retconned my count to include everything I’d ever done rather than only the things I’d done past this arbitrary “enthusiasm start date” (if you’re interested, this was 28th September 2013; the day I first rode the 1.4m coasters at Alton Towers). This added 3 creds I did at Disneyland Paris in March 2011 to my count, and it did also change the ordering of my creds (and some of my prior milestones) slightly.

It did have the undeniably helpful side effect of meaning that my 100th coaster was Iron Gwazi rather than Mumbo Jumbo at Flamingo Land (which is what it would have been had I not done this retcon). And at that time, it did helpfully boost me from 99 to 102…

That is not the reason I did it (I had a change of heart due to my dad finding an extensive hard drive of pictures and videos to give me exact ordering and dates for my earliest theme park visits), but it was undeniably a helpful bonus at the time!

On a mildly related note, one thing I remember me and my dad discussing was whether I’d done The Beastie at Alton Towers, as this would have affected what my 100th coaster actually was. It was still there when I first visited in 2009, but I had absolutely no memory of doing it, and neither of my parents had any memory of me riding it either. The conversation between me and my dad went something like this:

• Me: Dad, did I ever do The Beastie? It was still open when I first went, but I have absolutely no memory of ever having ridden it.
• Dad: I can’t actually remember, Matthew. I don’t remember taking you on it, but I’m not sure why we wouldn’t have done either.
• Me: There are no pictures on the hard drive of me ever having done it.
• Dad: Interesting… out of interest, what would your 100th coaster be without Beastie?
• Me: Iron Gwazi.
• Dad: And what would it be with Beastie?
• Me: The Sesame Street kiddie coaster at SeaWorld.
• Dad: OK, then; in that case, let’s say that you definitely didn’t do Beastie!

We later discussed it with my mum, and she had no memory of me doing Beastie either. So seeing as none of us could remember me doing Beastie and there was no photographic proof to the contrary, I didn’t ultimately count it!

 

[Nicky Borrill]

I’ve never removed creds from my count to “engineer” a specific milestone in that manner.

However, I did change my counting methodology last year and scrap the strange “enthusiasm start date” that I’d had up to that point to only count things I’d done after “becoming an enthusiast”. In July 2023, I retconned my count to include everything I’d ever done rather than only the things I’d done past this arbitrary “enthusiasm start date” (if you’re interested, this was 28th September 2013; the day I first rode the 1.4m coasters at Alton Towers). This added 3 creds I did at Disneyland Paris in March 2011 to my count, and it did also change the ordering of my creds (and some of my prior milestones) slightly.

It did have the undeniably helpful side effect of meaning that my 100th coaster was Iron Gwazi rather than Mumbo Jumbo at Flamingo Land (which is what it would have been had I not done this retcon). And at that time, it did helpfully boost me from 99 to 102…

That is not the reason I did it (I had a change of heart due to my dad finding an extensive hard drive of pictures and videos to give me exact ordering and dates for my earliest theme park visits), but it was undeniably a helpful bonus at the time!

On a mildly related note, one thing I remember me and my dad discussing was whether I’d done The Beastie at Alton Towers, as this would have affected what my 100th coaster actually was. It was still there when I first visited in 2009, but I had absolutely no memory of doing it, and neither of my parents had any memory of me riding it either. The conversation between me and my dad went something like this:

• Me: Dad, did I ever do The Beastie? It was still open when I first went, but I have absolutely no memory of ever having ridden it.
• Dad: I can’t actually remember, Matthew. I don’t remember taking you on it, but I’m not sure why we wouldn’t have done either.
• Me: There are no pictures on the hard drive of me ever having done it.
• Dad: Interesting… out of interest, what would your 100th coaster be without Beastie?
• Me: Iron Gwazi.
• Dad: And what would it be with Beastie?
• Me: The Sesame Street kiddie coaster at SeaWorld.
• Dad: OK, then; in that case, let’s say that you definitely didn’t do Beastie!

We later discussed it with my mum, and she had no memory of me doing Beastie either. So seeing as none of us could remember me doing Beastie and there was no photographic proof to the contrary, I didn’t ultimately count it!

I took a disposable camera to Alton Towers in either 1994 or 1995 specifically to take photos of Nemesis from Beastie (and other places too.) I filled the whole thing with Nemesis and got some great photos... Wish I still had them :/

You couldn't do that nowadays.

 

[LightningColossus46]

Personally I count any log flume that goes back up hill. In my mind this is no different than Flying Turns or any other bobsled moving up hill slightly. For my current creds, both American splash mo- I mean Tianas IP tie in high school dance DJ booth adventure. I also count Dudley do-rights. That one is even more obvious seeing as it has both the airtime hill as the main drop, but also a drop that goes up hill about halfway through the ride. Universal even advertised it as being part flume, part coaster. For splash, it has a speed hill on the second (indoor) drop. Also if you look at the 'trough' it converts closer to coaster track for these uphill segments.

I might get to Texas this year, and will most definitely count Journey to Atlantis and Catapult falls at SWSA.

 

[Slamming Coastercore]

I went through my coaster count profile the other day and realised I had Hollywood Tower (Movieland Italy) and Fuga da Atlantide (Gardaland) tickets... definitely some shame in those ones. Will I take them off my count though... na

Generally if it's on Coastercount i'll tick it. I only draw the line at Disco's mainly because I hate the things and don't want to ride them

 

[Hyde]

Really just powered coasters, especially Zamperla Mini Miner coasters (e.g. Back at the Banyard at Mall of America). I mean, still definitely, totally, counts.

 

[Heth]

I have counted Python amd Python v2 at Efteling as separate credits and have every intention of doing the same with Nemesis Reborn.

Technically both rides still retain some track their original versions, but they are basically new coasters.

 

[RevolutionRuleZ]

Anyone remember the Vikingar at BPB? Personally I'd say it was a coaster, and it even had a page at one point on the RCDB, however since it's closure that page was removed.

 

[cookie]

I counted Eurosat and CanCan Coaster as separate creds on coaster-count, even though CanCan does retain a small stretch of track from its predecessor. I might have done the same if I’d ever ridden the likes of Python, Hulk, or Nemesis before their retracks, but I didn’t, so…

 

[WhollyRudeTech]

I’m not sure I should count my life as one, but according to Ronan Keeting I should.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[LiveForTheLaunch]

Some pedal bike thingy at Yomiuriland comes to mind for me, although the name escapes me. At least, I think I counted it, haha.

Honourable mention goes to Black Diamond Mine at Knoebels, probably.

 

[DelPiero]

I've counted the seuss trolley at IOA, definitely my most contentious creds. But I haven't(and won't) counted any Discos, so that evens it out.

 

[Peet]

Probably Tower Coaster for me. Yeah it's powered and you control the speed yourself, but it looks and feels like a coaster, and if you describe it to somebody you'd almost certainly use the words "roller coaster", so on the list it goes. Plus it was expensive so I am definitely counting it

 

[thepoweroften]

One of those tiny, fifteen second travelling mine train coasters (I forget the exact one but I think I have it logged on coastercount, which I rarely update tbf). It technically does count but I feel kind of dirty counting it lol

 

[CedarPoint6]

I don't count powered or mountain, which eliminates a lot of issues for me.

The two biggest ones are probably the gravity powered wooden wild mouse type ghost trains at Conneaut Lake and Camden Park. RCDB delisted these a while ago, but they coaster uphill by gravity, run on/in a track, and have a wild mouse-like course. So I'm going to keep those two.

The other one that I seem to be more in the minority on is mobius coasters being only 1 credit. You can't close one side and still operate the other like you can on a twin tracked ride, so it becomes one for me. Effectively 1/2 and 1/2, but that's never been an issues for me as I went 3 for 3 on getting both sides of the mobius wooden coasters. I'm just always surprised to see so many count mobius as 2.