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Thorpe Park | Hyperia | Mack Hyper Coaster | 2024

Cheers for the link; very helpful!

So in theory, Thorpe is far enough from Heathrow for it not to be within the inner surface?
It's on the very edge, and on the very basic charts I have access to it looks like part is inside, part is outside... Thankfully Loggers is in the bottom corner, the bit that looks as though it juts out into the OHS. :) But I'm not confident these plans are perfectly accurate...

Either way, it's on the very edge, if inside, technically it's 68M, outside it's 150M... So the very worst case scenario is that they can build up to 222ft
 
I’m not convinced with this.. Why would they mention “removal of old rides” & “Old Town being the new area” in an invitation to residents? Surely that part comes in the consultation anyway. Seems like it was put there to hype the rumours up 🙃
 
Not of strict relevance to the ongoing conversation but this website is an absolute joy for looking at various planning things.


I want to build my theme park..... here. Oh wait it's on an ancient ****ing monument, nooooo!!!!
 
Actually Matt... Found this for you, explains it WAYYYY better than I ever could! https://www.pagerpower.com/news/about-obstacle-limitation-surfaces-overview/



Without access to the detailed zoomable plan, I can't, I can only make a rough guess... But the point is, the limit is at least 222ft either way, giving them scope to build the UK's tallest coaster. And lying on the very edge, would give them a very high chance of gaining permission to exceed that height even if they are just inside anyway.

Thorpe have a much bigger job on their hands getting around local council planning than they do getting around Heathrow limitations... I don't see them struggling there to be fair either.

If Thorpe is about on the edge of the conical section, then it would be on the higher edge of it, and as such the side of Thorpe nearest to Heathrow would still have a ~145m limit.
 
I’m not convinced with this.. Why would they mention “removal of old rides” & “Old Town being the new area” in an invitation to residents? Surely that part comes in the consultation anyway. Seems like it was put there to hype the rumours up 🙃
The Chessington one mentioned the area as well, and “removal of old rides” may well be notifying residents that construction will be going on in terms of tree clearance of currently wooded areas and such.

Also, someone on Thorpe Park Mania confirmed that all of their family and friends in the Thorpe/Egham area received a flyer telling them about this consultation, so I definitely think this is real, personally.
 
Sorry Matt, Benjacobs had already used the full term in his post, so I assumed that I could use the abbreviations…

They are Inner horizontal surface and outer horizontal surface… They are zones, spreading out from an airport, that amongst other things, define protected areas, such as areas with certain build height limits. So Heathrow has a small roughly 4-5km ish radius area around it with a 68m height limit, and also a bigger radius around it with a 150m height limit.

This is the rough copy of Heathrow’s (there’s a much more detailed map available too, but it’s pdf)

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This map actually shows where the area that fixed wing aircraft can’t enter. The IHS and CS should form a radius of around 6km, Thorpe’s nearest side is about 6.8km from the nearest part of the runway, so should be entirely within the OHS.
 
Yeah, I'll believe it when it happens. The overall wording of that flyer just doesn't sound like something a trained copywriter or similar would write? I WANT to believe, but Thorpe goons are the way they are and I'm skeptical.

Also I don't get why you'd make a website... to announce a website... which advertises a public consultation. Odd.
 
I’m not convinced with this.. Why would they mention “removal of old rides” & “Old Town being the new area” in an invitation to residents? Surely that part comes in the consultation anyway. Seems like it was put there to hype the rumours up 🙃

Well we only need to wait until the 10th of December until the site becomes live.
 
This map actually shows where the area that fixed wing aircraft can’t enter. The IHS and CS should form a radius of around 6km, Thorpe’s nearest side is about 6.8km from the nearest part of the runway, so should be entirely within the OHS.
No, it shows the I + O HS as I pulled it from planning documents ;)

Edit: I should rephrase that, as it does show the airspace (CTR...) But according to 2 separate planning documents, the same boundaries also define the I + O HS... I've tried and tried to find a better source for a better version, but these planning documents are the best source I can find...


Edit Edit: It appears you were right, and those documents were using the CTR chart incorrectly 🙈🤣

One of them was the planning application for the old nestle factory on Hillingdon planning portal too 🙈

Anyway, please accept my apologies... Assuming this one is correct, (I also found this in a planning application, lol) and those ones were wrong... Thorpe is definitely not restricted below 500ft by Heathrow Airport!!!
 

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No, it shows the I + O HS as I pulled it from planning documents ;)

Edit: I should rephrase that, as it does show the airspace (CTR...) But according to 2 separate planning documents, the same boundaries also define the I + O HS... I've tried and tried to find a better source for a better version, but these planning documents are the best source I can find...


Edit Edit: It appears you were right, and those documents were using the CTR chart incorrectly 🙈🤣

One of them was the planning application for the old nestle factory on Hillingdon planning portal too 🙈

Anyway, please accept my apologies... Assuming this one is correct, (I also found this in a planning application, lol) and those ones were wrong... Thorpe is definitely not restricted below 500ft by Heathrow Airport!!!

No worries, I thought it was odd that it was an irregular shape and didn't show the CS, so did a reverse image search. That new image definitely looks like it. Not very good that the people applying for planning permission for a large project like that don’t even know which is which!
 
So the 3 coaster B&M deal must be true because of the coaster at the new Legoland in China, Chessington’s new coaster and this probably.
Not it, a lot bigger. B&M signed a separate 6 coaster deal with Merlin. 5 of them are spread across their three Chinese Legoland projects (3 junior inverts, 2 family-sized wing coasters), plus Chessington.

The 3 coaster deal, if anything, I gather would appear to include Thorpe and two Alton Towers projects, one of which would be a Nemesis re-track (a la Incredible Hulk in 2016, B&M coasters don't have an extended lifespan so expect a handful of their coasters to receive such treatment this decade or just simply bite the dust)
 
No worries, I thought it was odd that it was an irregular shape and didn't show the CS, so did a reverse image search. That new image definitely looks like it. Not very good that the people applying for planning permission for a large project like that don’t even know which is which!
So you're fairly certain this one is accurate?

Glad we finally found the right one, and can finally put an end to the Thorpe / Heathrow rumours!!!

It is important to note though (before any of you run off making youtube videos!!!) that we’re not saying Thorpe have no height limit, or a height limit of 500ft!!!

We’re saying that there is no default legal height limit because of their proximity to Heathrow, other than 150m!!! There COULD well be other things limiting their maximum construction height, such as local planning limitations, that we’re not aware of!!!

So don’t assume that because their proximity to Heathrow allows up to 150m, they’re allowed to build up to 150m… There could be other limiting factors!
 
Sorry for derailing the topic a bit, but can I just pull you up on this little snippet from the previous page, Matt, regarding the Chessington project.

and that B&M was officially confirmed as the manufacturer

Where is the "official confirmation" that it will be a B&M? Have I missed something?
 
It is important to note though (before any of you run off making youtube videos!!!) that we’re not saying Thorpe have no height limit, or a height limit of 500ft!!!

We’re saying that there is no default legal height limit because of their proximity to Heathrow, other than 150m!!! There COULD well be other things limiting their maximum construction height, such as local planning limitations, that we’re not aware of!!!

So don’t assume that because their proximity to Heathrow allows up to 150m, they’re allowed to build up to 150m… There could be other limiting factors!
I'm going to chip in and add that this seems to suggest that the park are effectively under the same limitations they were under when building Stealth.
The only kind of details I'm aware of that are online related to heights and the park come from the park's MTDP, and the old Stealth mini-site. The MTDP is outdated now really. The Stealth mini-site said that as long as their structures are less than 500ft in height, they don't need to install aviation lights (though given that was 16 years ago, laws may well have changed).

In short: I don't know of anything like that. But Thorpe could probably still build that high if they really wanted and were able to keep the locals sweet.

(Side note: How nice was that Stealth mini site <3)
In terms of local planning limitations, I'll add some fuel to the flames and say I don't think there's any written limitation that says the park (or anywhere within Runnymede) can't build something that high. But at the same, I don't think anyone would be happy with a 457ft plonked at Thorpe. I also imagine that the location of being on an island and Thorpe's (over?)-care when running in wind and other adverse weather means that they'd never realistically consider something that high.

However, it certainly does mean that something that hits the 200ft+ mark is plausible.

Sorry for derailing the topic a bit, but can I just pull you up on this little snippet from the previous page, Matt, regarding the Chessington project.



Where is the "official confirmation" that it will be a B&M? Have I missed something?
Someone's clearly hanging on for hope that Chessington's thing is an S&S Axis so they can get that drink... ;)

Ah right; thanks for the clarification @JoshC.! I never knew that Project Zer0 ever actually amounted to anything… I definitely learnt something new today!

I wonder why it was ever linked to Thorpe, then?
Sorry to divert away from Thorpe coaster talk again, but just to clarify.

Project Zer0 hype started around 2017, when people saw a "0?" painted on a scrap piece of wood by a Fright Nights maze (I think Big Top). People over-analysed it and expected it to relate to a new coaster at Thorpe. When the aforementioned escape rooms were being built, the team behind it (who used to work at Thorpe Park, and knew it was not related to a new coaster) used this interest to their advantage, and built a teaser campaign around 'Project 0?'. Very clever really.

Things then got complicated when some posts on Thorpe's social media posts started using numbers to replace letters (0 to replace o, 1 to replace i, etc) in 2018, around the same time earlier teasers for the escape rooms started. As far as I know, there was nothing behind it except having some fun with fans. But then it meant you had this very real 'Project Zer0' happening, and this joke 'numbers replacing letters' thing, which were completely separate.

Thorpe eventually stopped with the jovial teasers of the numbers replacing letters, and Project Zer0 was announced as the escape rooms (a bit earlier than planned I think, as people thought it was just a hoax by some Thorpe geeks). Ultimately led to some people thinking Project Zer0 was something that fizzled to nothing, some thinking it was all a hoax and some realising it for what it was meant to be.
 
Sorry for derailing the topic a bit, but can I just pull you up on this little snippet from the previous page, Matt, regarding the Chessington project.



Where is the "official confirmation" that it will be a B&M? Have I missed something?
They confirmed it in terms of the track design, and they also used Raptor at Gardaland as a noise study, so I’d say that we could probably ascertain a B&M based on those two things.

Admittedly, I think I did use a slightly poor choice of wording there in hindsight, but my point is; I think a full planning application would give us enough evidence to piece together in order to determine a manufacturer.
 
Thanks, that's what I was looking for. 😉



I mean, durrr! That's totally it. And rest assured when it happens, I will be cashing in. 😁
Gawdddd somebody said the other day they were hoping for a S&S axis coaster at Thorpe!!!

I cannot think of a coaster type I’d least like to see, it really doesn’t interest me… Looks like it will be all spin and no airtime… Any part of the layout that might give some airtime instead forces the seat to spin… Sod that, not my thing!
 
^Just to clarify, I'm not hoping for an S&S Axis coaster because I want it to be an S&S Axis coaster, I'm hoping for an S&S Axis coaster because I want to be right about something for a change and get a few free drinks out of it!
What coaster do I want it to be? Oh yeah, B&M all day long.

Edited to add: that's the Chessie one I was referring to but, dear lord, what if it is the Thorpe Park one? 😮
Unfortunately we can't actually rule that out at the moment. We know that there's been interest in the Axis idea from somewhere in Europe, and nobody's come forward with any other credible locations for it, soooooo..... 🤷‍♂️
 
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^Just to clarify, I'm not hoping for an S&S Axis coaster because I want it to be an S&S Axis coaster, I'm hoping for an S&S Axis coaster because I want to be right about something for a change and get a few free drinks out of it!
What coaster do I want it to be? Oh yeah, B&M all day long.

Edited to add: that's the Chessie one I was referring to but, dear lord, what if it is the Thorpe Park one? 😮
Unfortunately we can't actually rule that out at the moment. We know that there's been interest in the Axis idea from somewhere in Europe, and nobody's come forward with any other credible locations for it, soooooo..... 🤷‍♂️
Oh I know… It just reminded me of a conversation I had the other day!!!

If Thorpe order an unproven type like an Axis coaster after the disaster that was DBGT… Then somebody wants sacking!

Don’t get me wrong, it could prove to be a success, I’m not saying it won’t, but it is a risk, a big gamble, that I’d be surprised to see authorised after DBGT!
 
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