Thorpe Park | Hyperia | Mack Hyper Coaster | 2024

[spicy]

Well now it’s confirmed by the park I’m pleasantly surprised.

I got to admit I didn’t believe that any of this would actually come to anything.

Now let’s just pray it’s something decent.

 

[catsounds]

World-class is what Merlin would say about any coaster they build. What I can't help but notice though, is that there is no mention of "record-breaking" in their reply posts, which slightly concerns me. Surely, if they were gonna get a hyper or the UK's tallest, they'd want to claim that as record breaking even of it isn't a world record, since it's Merlin?

I mean a well designed and Maverick-topping intamin blitz wouldn't fit either of those categories so (not that i think it will be that) that might be a sign of change if we're lucky They used that term for Wickerman originally also and that's still a very worthy addition

 

[roomraider]

I dont really want to speculate but just to comment on something I've seen a few people mention.
Theres been mention of a 3 coaster deal between B&M and Merlin and mention that this includes the Legoland park in China.

There is an issue with this though. There are 3 currently confirmed Legoland parks for China in Shenzhen, Chengdu and Shanghai.
All 3 of them have the same (Currently still assumed to be from B&M) Junior inverted coaster. And 2 of them (Shenzhen and Chengdu) have what could also be B&M built launched junior wing coasters.

If there is any truth to the B&M 3 coaster deal with Merlin then it means

1) The Junior inverted coasters at the legolands arent B&M's but all 3 coasters in the deal are Junior Wing Coasters (CWOA, Legoland Shenzhen and Legoland Chengdu) which means Thorpe Park isnt getting a B&M.
2) None of the Legoland rides are B&M and we therefore only know about 1 of the 3 B&M coasters (CWOA).
3) The 3 coaster deal is rubbish and they have actually bought anywhere between 1 and 6 B&M coasters.

 

[Matt N]

I dont really want to speculate but just to comment on something I've seen a few people mention.
Theres been mention of a 3 coaster deal between B&M and Merlin and mention that this includes the Legoland park in China.

There is an issue with this though. There are 3 currently confirmed Legoland parks for China in Shenzhen, Chengdu and Shanghai.
All 3 of them have the same (Currently still assumed to be from B&M) Junior inverted coaster. And 2 of them (Shenzhen and Chengdu) have what could also be B&M built launched junior wing coasters.

If there is any truth to the B&M 3 coaster deal with Merlin then it means

1) The Junior inverted coasters at the legolands arent B&M's but all 3 coasters in the deal are Junior Wing Coasters (CWOA, Legoland Shenzhen and Legoland Chengdu) which means Thorpe Park isnt getting a B&M.
2) None of the Legoland rides are B&M and we therefore only know about 1 of the 3 B&M coasters (CWOA).
3) The 3 coaster deal is rubbish and they have actually bought anywhere between 1 and 6 B&M coasters.

I have an alternative suggestion; could Merlin have signed one B&M deal for Legolands and another for Resort Theme Parks?

I only suggest this because they are separate divisions of Merlin (the company treats them separately in terms of CAPEX strategy, and they're also treated separately in results presentations and such), and they don't often seem to share much common ground in terms of ride types commonly purchased (for instance, Merlin has thrown tons of Brogent flying theatres into Legoland parks, but absolutely none into RTPs. Ditto with Mack wild mouse coasters, and there are almost definitely more that I can't think of right now), implying that bulk deals for Legoland parks may well be signed separately to those for RTPs.

So would it be plausible that Legolands have an entirely separate B&M deal that has nothing to do with B&M coasters being built in the Resort Theme Parks, meaning that the RTPs could have their own B&M deal?

 

[TPoseOnTantrum]

I have an alternative suggestion; could Merlin have signed one B&M deal for Legolands and another for Resort Theme Parks?

I only suggest this because they are separate divisions of Merlin (the company treats them separately in terms of CAPEX strategy, and they're also treated separately in results presentations and such), and they don't often seem to share much common ground in terms of ride types commonly purchased (for instance, Merlin has thrown tons of Brogent flying theatres into Legoland parks, but absolutely none into RTPs. Ditto with Mack wild mouse coasters, and there are almost definitely more that I can't think of right now), implying that bulk deals for Legoland parks may well be signed separately to those for RTPs.

So would it be plausible that Legolands have an entirely separate B&M deal that has nothing to do with B&M coasters being built in the Resort Theme Parks, meaning that the RTPs could have their own B&M deal?

It's a very plausible theory. From what I have previously heard in the past, a 6 coaster deal was originally signed off the bat for 5 Legoland coasters in China and Chessington's B&M wing, and its a claim that I've been pushing plenty. However, the recent rumors would suggest a separate new deal involving Thorpe and Towers; Chessington could have easily been the third one involved here. Hardware and timeline-wise, though, it does fit a little better with the Chinese deal given that one of the three Legoland parks is conveniently missing one of three family-sized launched B&M wings acquired. 3 family inverts, 3 family wings. Chessington could have swapped it from there, or it could have come from the UK deal and that missing coaster ends up being an odd end.

 

[Pokemaniac]

Now let’s just pray it’s something decent.

Something decent would be good, but let's face it, "decent" would be a bit of a disappointment.

I'd say Thorpe is pretty much the one place in the UK with the chance of getting something great. A white-knuckle thrill coaster worth planning a trip for. Alton has the height and noise limits, BPB hasn't got any room, London Resort doesn't exist, nowhere else has the budget (or it's way outside the scope for the parks that could otherwise reasonably afford it, like Legoland). Thorpe remains the only decently big park with a thrill-focused scope, and both the funds and the space to build a big coaster.

The rate at which Thorpe builds coasters seems to decline logarithmically these days too. If the current trend holds, the next coaster after this will be sometime in the late 2030s.

Which means that it's basically Thorpe or nowhere, and now or never. Okay, "never" is an exaggeration, but the once-in-a-blue-moon chance is here and the next one appears to be quite far away. This is the chance for a really great coaster in the UK for the foreseeable future. Something that makes the continental coaster fans book a trip across the channel. A top 10 contender.

So not to be ungrateful, but if it's anything less than a Hyper, it better be a damn good coaster in some other way. Not a souped-up family GCI with a horror theme, gimmicky boomerang or mid-sized semi-shuttle from Gerstlauer's bargain bin. I mean, those coasters could probably be fine additions to the park in isolation, but given how this is the once-in-a-blue-moon chance, it would feel like a wasted opportunity.

(yeah, I'm projecting a bit, but I've completely given up any chances of something good being built in my own country at this point)

 

[roomraider]

I have an alternative suggestion; could Merlin have signed one B&M deal for Legolands and another for Resort Theme Parks?

I only suggest this because they are separate divisions of Merlin (the company treats them separately in terms of CAPEX strategy, and they're also treated separately in results presentations and such), and they don't often seem to share much common ground in terms of ride types commonly purchased (for instance, Merlin has thrown tons of Brogent flying theatres into Legoland parks, but absolutely none into RTPs. Ditto with Mack wild mouse coasters, and there are almost definitely more that I can't think of right now), implying that bulk deals for Legoland parks may well be signed separately to those for RTPs.

So would it be plausible that Legolands have an entirely separate B&M deal that has nothing to do with B&M coasters being built in the Resort Theme Parks, meaning that the RTPs could have their own B&M deal?

Of course thats entirely possible. However then in that casse we fall back to basically option 2. None of the B&M's in the deal we are talking about are for China and we only officially(ish) know about 1 of the B&M's in the 3 coaster deal.

Basicially either the 3 coaster deal exists and it doesnt involve any rides in China so we only know about 1 of them. Or it doesnt exist at all.
The thing is I've seen people in this thread and elsewhere mention a 3 coaster deal and mention Legoland China in that. I think either way thats impossible.

 

[Nitefly]

If Staines is getting an airtime machine and Thorpe Park must involve an ancient IP, as is tradition, then I do hope they call it “Expedition Ali G-Force”.

 

[CrashCoaster]

Does anyone know if Thorpe owns this plot of land?

Cause if so, we could possibly see a Candymonium-style hyper going out that way.

(Layout only a rough idea, made in about 7 seconds.)

 

[Nicky Borrill]

Of course thats entirely possible. However then in that casse we fall back to basically option 2. None of the B&M's in the deal we are talking about are for China and we only officially(ish) know about 1 of the B&M's in the 3 coaster deal.

Basicially either the 3 coaster deal exists and it doesnt involve any rides in China so we only know about 1 of them. Or it doesnt exist at all.
The thing is I've seen people in this thread and elsewhere mention a 3 coaster deal and mention Legoland China in that. I think either way thats impossible.

It has been said several times that it is separate to the the China deal. The original claim was that it was actually a 3.5 coaster deal for UK’s Merlin parks.

Chessington
Thorpe
SW9 and a Nemesis retrack thrown in for good measure.

I didn’t believe it then, and I’m still not sure I believe it now… But if this does turn out to be a B&M, then it will start to make me wonder.

Sorry to double post, but as @CrashCoaster posted in the Small News from the Theme Park Industry thread, Theme Park Predictions had a “very reliable source” tell them something very interesting to do with Thorpe Park’s next project:

If you don’t want to watch the video, he’s basically suggesting that Merlin has signed some form of multi buy deal with B&M (with Chessington’s new coaster and various upcoming Chinese Legolands having one or more B&Ms within them, I don’t think this is the most obscene theory by any means), and this will result in Thorpe’s next coaster being a B&M Hyper Coaster on the Loggers spot (although quite possibly stretching out of the Loggers area) that will beat the Big One’s UK height record and possibly Stealth’s UK speed record as well. He says that signs of construction will begin next year and that the ride will open in 2023.

Do of course take this with a pinch of salt, but he says that his source is reliable, and if this does come true, I think it could be very exciting! I’ll admit I’m slightly doubtful about the prospect of a 2023 opening, as I’m unsure whether Thorpe would want to infringe on Chessington’s project, and I also feel as though we would have seen more in the way of planning permission by now given the scale of such a project, but I don’t think the ride type and nature of ride suggested seems at all inconceivable, personally, and I think such a ride would be a phenomenal fit at Thorpe!

On an unrelated note, he also says that Towers’ next coaster will be some form of out and back B&M stretching between Dark Forest and Forbidden Valley (utilising the valley) that will open in 2024 “barring any setbacks”. His source says that The Blade will be removed in order to facilitate the construction of some sort of turnaround element for the new coaster, therefore from what the video shows, I think I can ascertain that the station would be going somewhere in Dark Forest, around where Darkest Depths is located at Scarefest. A ride type was not indicated by the source, but the content creator himself suggests either a mini Hyper Coaster or multi-launch Surf Coaster.

As I say, do take this with a pinch of salt, but it’s certainly an interesting rumour, if nothing else!

 

[Sjnoebel]

Everybody is talking about the 3 b&m deal and talking about the parks in the UK but what about Heidepark in Germany which is also Merlin and plenty of space and no rumors at all of a new attraction in the works.

 

[Nicky Borrill]

Everybody is talking about the 3 b&m deal and talking about the parks in the UK but what about Heidepark in Germany which is also Merlin and plenty of space and no rumors at all of a new attraction in the works.

We want ALL the B&Ms

Edit: on a serious note though, I think the retrack counts as their big investment for now…

 

[whippedcream]

Well when Inferno was under construction, wasn’t that classed as a world-class experience back then; so this is a B&M confirmed in my eyes until I could be proven extremely wrong…

But on a serious note, it’s nice to know the park is actually doing something and I am looking forward to whatever they have to offer!

 

[FistedColossus]

I certainly wouldn't be disappointed with a B&M Hyper but I'm still hopeful for a massive RMC.

Wickerman has proven to Merlin that wood is good and a hybrid coaster would give them a lot to play about with from a marketing perspective.

 

[Coasterfreck]

Well when Inferno was under construction, wasn’t that classed as a world-class experience back then; so this is a B&M confirmed in my eyes until I could be proven extremely wrong…

It was indeed classed as “world’s greatest coaster experience”, from finding an archive picture on attraction source. Optimistically hopeful that this is going to be a B&M Hyper that the UK needs. If it turns out to be an RMC, that be good too.

The only thing I really don’t want this investment to turn out to be the S&S Axis prototype. After DBGT they really don’t need another prototype to sting them. I know Slammer was the second S&S SkySwatt, but it was still an expensive ride for maintaining, and didn’t have a good reliability (albeit it did in it’s final season)

 

[JoshC.]

Does anyone know if Thorpe owns this plot of land?

Fairly certain Thorpe can't build there. Here's (roughly) what land they have to play with:


The blue line is roughly what is Monk's walk, the public pathway which runs alongside the park. This is something which requires consideration and could be a hurdle for any coaster round there; it's a popular stretch with locals, dogwalkers, cyclists, etc (and also goons of course).
The black and pink lines represent zones where different levels of development can be done; anything inside the pink line in particular is classed as the "Development Zone". Obviously for this section of course, it's pretty inconsequential what the difference between these two lines is.

For further reference, the two lines crossing the water: the upper one is Loggers Leap, the lower one is what was the train route (and then used for Platform 15).

A crude aerial view may help too:

That includes roughly all of the kids area of Old Town, the Loggers Leap and Platform 15 routes (up to running alongside, but not crossing, Saw). There's also potential to extend it over to Slammer's site (not shown on aerial image, but very nearby) I guess.

 

[Howie]

Ok I'm just gonna come out and say it: I don't think that area is big enough for a B&M hyper. At least, not the kind of B&M hyper that we're all hoping for. Not the gigantic, Shambhala-crushing, height & speed record breaking, out & back monster that's at the top of (almost) everyone's wish list.
I also think that such a coaster, even with a bulk-buy discount, is simply too expensive for Thorpe Park. You've got to be talking £30 million for something like that, surely?
Nah, at this point I'm still leaning towards wood or hybrid. Firstly because the footprint of the land in question simply looks more like a wood or hybrid shaped coaster than a hyper coaster, and secondly because wood or hybrid would allow Thorpe Park to claim a whole bunch of records, and still potentially something "world-class", for a LOT less cash.

 

[Nicky Borrill]

Ok I'm just gonna come out say it: I don't think that area is big enough for a B&M hyper. At least, not the kind of B&M hyper that we're all hoping for. Not the gigantic, Shambhala-crushing, height & speed record breaking, out & back monster that's at the top of (almost) everyone's wish list.
I also think that such a coaster, even with a bulk-buy discount, is simply too expensive for Thorpe Park. You've got to be talking £30 million for something like that, surely?
Nah, at this point I'm still leaning towards wood or hybrid. Firstly because the footprint of the land in question simply looks more like a wood or hybrid shaped coaster than a hyper coaster, and secondly because wood or hybrid would allow Thorpe Park to claim a whole bunch of records, and still potentially something "world-class", for a LOT less cash.

I said this exact thing a few pages ago… And it sparked conversation about extending the coaster along park boundaries, using the lake, or installing a more spaghetti bowl hyper

Still think it looks more like a RMC or GCI shape to me, but we’ll see…

Edit: To put this into perspective, assuming a logger leap and old town footprint (so no fancy coaster over the lake / to the entrance etc etc) Thorpes longest straight line would only just fit Shambhala's lift and first drop in it... And would mean an immediate very tight turnaround!!!

 

[Jared]

Are we not including the slammer site as part of this development? They’d be foolish to have all the gear in and a project in place and to still leave that old pile of junk sitting there? The queue etc for Black Mirror could easily be rerouted for a season whilst they remove slammer and it’d also open up a nice plot for a potential station to go in?

 

[Nicky Borrill]

Are we not including the slammer site as part of this development? They’d be foolish to have all the gear in and a project in place and to still leave that old pile of junk sitting there? The queue etc for Black Mirror could easily be rerouted for a season whilst they remove slammer and it’d also open up a nice plot for a potential station to go in?

Including Slammer only gives them 50ish more metres for a straight line lift and drop... Still means an immediate and tight turnaround...