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Wild Mouse at BPB Closure - R.I.P. 1958-2017

Also, attendance is only one way of measuring success.

If revenue is up, or showing signs of improvement, or guest satisfaction has increased, or return visits / new visitors are on the up, it's a good sign. Attendance can be affected by plenty of things out of a park's control, so isn't always a good indicator.
 
Yeah, attendance doesn't necessarily affect income. More season members in fact decrease SPH etc. Enthusiasts are so quick to jump to the mark of understanding business and if they're doing well or not based off of Facebook comments or 'when I went it was quiet'.
 
Self-Propelled Howitzer. By "More season members in fact decrease SPH", I think Lofty meant that the more people go to parks, the less they go to war.
 
Lofty said:
That's strictly not true, though. They do in fact have plans for that site and some of it will be used later this year for something - you're saying all this like removing Wild Mouse is going to cause a huge decrease in attendance to the park when in reality the only people that will boycott the park are a handful of self-righteous enthusiasts letting nostalgia guide their idiotic beliefs.

Things like this piss me off, to be honest. This same type of enthusiast will be the first to cry and belittle 'the public' when the park closes down due to low attendance. Moan about them removing a ride and not replacing it; boycotts the park so they won't generate enough income to build a new ride. I know this is an extreme scenario but my point still stands. How about you support the park and hopefully they'll fill the space with something worthy in the future instead of sitting bitching on a forum about the removal...
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Firstly, you're putting words in my mouth that I haven't said, find me anywhere I suggested boycotting the park??

I'm not for one moment suggesting I'll never visit again, so I'm not sure how you've made that deduction. But actively supporting a park when they showed such disdain for the removal of one of the most unique and historic coasters in the world? Really? Even taking off my "enthusiast glasses" and forgetting nostalgia, it wasn't right. I wouldn't have as much of an issue if they'd gone about it in a better way, but tearing it down and hoping people would just forget about it because of Icon just doesn't go down well with me.

Furthermore, my point still stands, their statement (the way the park chose to communicate this, no-one else, they said this themselves) quoted making way for future developments as the reason for the ride's removal. If this is true, why remove it when any potential new development isn't anywhere near ready to start being installed? Why not, for example, go about it respectfully like Efteling have done with Bob; offer last rides, announce that it'll be closing and have the replacement organised.

I am fully aware there were reasons for Mouse not being able to reopen; however, the way the park chose to communicate the closure is ultimately how they should be judged IMO. If you don't have an issue with it then fine, but don't start calling people self-righteous idiots or making entirely false statements because they have a different viewpoint to you.
 
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Everyone's free to their own opinions and feelings towards Blackpool Pleasure Beach over this decision and the way they handled it, but something important that I reckon we should consider is; maybe Wild Mouse's removal was an unplanned decision? Maybe it was taken because of a major technical problem or safety issue that couldn't easily be fixed, and the park had plans to properly announce the removal at a later date; look at what happened with Volcano at Kings Dominion recently, for example. It might well have been a similar case in Blackpool. It might only have been because of an unlucky set of circumstances that an enthusiast managed to stumble across the park in early January and take a picture, thus revealing the demolition to the world earlier than BPB had planned, therefore making them panic and put out the response that they did.

I'm sure that if that photo hadn't been taken and the news hadn't started to spread around the internet, BPB would have revealed the removal in a manner that would please more people.

Also, some people act like Amanda doesn't care about BPB's history. I'm sure she does care; I saw an article online saying that Amanda was in tears when considering whether to remove Wild Mouse or not. If she didn't care for BPB's history, I'm sure that many of the other older rides would have disappeared by now. I'm sure that if you'd asked Amanda in early 2017 whether she would be removing the Wild Mouse a year later, she would have laughed in your face and reassured you that the Mouse would be staying for years to come.
 
Coaster said:
Firstly, you're putting words in my mouth that I haven't said, find me anywhere I suggested boycotting the park??
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Lofty wasn't putting words in your mouth. He said: "This same type of enthusiast ... boycotts the park ...". He didn't say you were boycotting the park. He also stated "this is an extreme scenario" to get his point across.
Don't get me wrong. I was just as upset as you are. BPB Wild Mouse is #5 in my Top 10 and although you don't have your CC listed, I'm over 1000 and putting Wild Mouse at #5 says how much I loved it. But these things happen and we all have to move on, regardless of the circumstances.
 
ECG said:
Lofty wasn't putting words in your mouth. He said: "This same type of enthusiast ... boycotts the park ...". He didn't say you were boycotting the park. He also stated "this is an extreme scenario" to get his point across.
Don't get me wrong. I was just as upset as you are. BPB Wild Mouse is #5 in my Top 10 and although you don't have your CC listed, I'm over 1000 and putting Wild Mouse at #5 says how much I loved it. But these things happen and we all have to move on, regardless of the circumstances.
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I read his post differently if I'm honest, it seems odd to make a sweeping statement about a "type of enthusiast" in direct reply to my post if it's aimed at someone else. Also he talks about boycotting the park and then goes on to say "how about you support the park" in the next sentence.

It's purely a matter of different opinions and I think responding to an impersonal post with digs at enthusiasts, whether it's aimed at me or otherwise, is unnecessary.
 
TBH your post does make you come across as one of those types of enthusiasts, though perhaps not as extreme.
 
It was a general statement about enthusiasts that share the same point belief that you do - the same types of posts you've posted and the manner of your comments about the park are the same as those. If the shoe fits...

The way you are posting (this is directly aimed at you) is that Pleasure Beach have purposely removed Wild Mouse as a malicious act and not that of a business needing to. The ride needed lots of work doing to it, which with its heritage proves difficult as there's only a minute number of companies specialising in such work on heritage rides. Yes, the communication about this happening was abysmal, and some form of notice would've been great, but it wouldn't have stopped the outcome of the removal. Plain and simple.
 
Lofty said:
It was a general statement about enthusiasts that share the same point belief that you do - the same types of posts you've posted and the manner of your comments about the park are the same as those. If the shoe fits...

The way you are posting (this is directly aimed at you) is that Pleasure Beach have purposely removed Wild Mouse as a malicious act and not that of a business needing to. The ride needed lots of work doing to it, which with its heritage proves difficult as there's only a minute number of companies specialising in such work on heritage rides. Yes, the communication about this happening was abysmal, and some form of notice would've been great, but it wouldn't have stopped the outcome of the removal. Plain and simple.
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The way the park handled it is my main issue, it shows that they just didn't care.
 
No, it does not.

It's an incredibly difficult process to go through to remove one of your much-loved and iconic rides. They'd have faced extremely negative feedback regardless of announcing the removal prior/post the actual action - as has happened and you're proving right now. It does not show that they 'don't care', in fact, I can absolutely tell you right now that a lot of the senior management and most-definitely the Thompsons care a lot more than you do.

It was the Thompsons' family legacy. They were literally removing a part of their own heritage and identity as a family owned business. Just remove yourself from the scenario and look at it face value - you're a consumer, you're not an operator, a Thompson or anyone that actually matters to their business. Simple, really.
 
Lofty said:
No, it does not.

It's an incredibly difficult process to go through to remove one of your much-loved and iconic rides. They'd have faced extremely negative feedback regardless of announcing the removal prior/post the actual action - as has happened and you're proving right now. It does not show that they 'don't care', in fact, I can absolutely tell you right now that a lot of the senior management and most-definitely the Thompsons care a lot more than you do.

It was the Thompsons' family legacy. They were literally removing a part of their own heritage and identity as a family owned business. Just remove yourself from the scenario and look at it face value - you're a consumer, you're not an operator, a Thompson or anyone that actually matters to their business. Simple, really.
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But the statement read that it was to make way for future developments, it was rushed out (once they were asked for one) as they had failed to announce anything beforehand.

A park that cared would have handled it properly, they'd have put a display up about the history of the ride, the statement would have encouraged people to share their best memories of such a fantastic historic ride. Their statement basically said "it's progress". I genuinely don't believe the Thompsons care for the history of the park, removing the historical markers from all their classic rides, it's almost like they're ashamed of it when they should be proud.

I'm looking at it through the eyes of a consumer because that's what I am, and the way PB communicated it is how I have based my opinion. Customers do matter to their business, and whilst one customer won't make a difference if they upset a large number (not suggesting Mouse alone would have put loads of people off going, but a combination of things) then they're in trouble.
 
I'm sorry, but you're absolutely deluded if you think they don't care about the heritage of their FAMILY HISTORY. I can't believe you're just not getting this, at all.

You clearly have your mind set on this being a personal attack from the park, and no sensical talking to you is ever going to make you realise that they did this for a reason, not just because they wanted to.

Again, your last statement really links back to what I was saying... "Customers do matter to their business, and whilst one customer won't make a difference if they upset a large number (not suggesting Mouse alone would have put loads of people off going, but a combination of things) then they're in trouble.", the reality of the situation is that in the grand scheme of things, the people that are affected by this ride and are 'upset' by this move are absolutely the minority and I doubt would even have a slight effect on the business when a new ride would completely outweigh those people.

You just aren't seeing this in a logical manner, I completely and utterly understand that this might have affected you and you're clearly annoyed by it - but your general statements are absolutely wrong and formed by a pointed opinion.
 
Lofty said:
I'm sorry, but you're absolutely deluded if you think they don't care about the heritage of their FAMILY HISTORY. I can't believe you're just not getting this, at all.

You clearly have your mind set on this being a personal attack from the park, and no sensical talking to you is ever going to make you realise that they did this for a reason, not just because they wanted to.

Again, your last statement really links back to what I was saying... "Customers do matter to their business, and whilst one customer won't make a difference if they upset a large number (not suggesting Mouse alone would have put loads of people off going, but a combination of things) then they're in trouble.", the reality of the situation is that in the grand scheme of things, the people that are affected by this ride and are 'upset' by this move are absolutely the minority and I doubt would even have a slight effect on the business when a new ride would completely outweigh those people.

You just aren't seeing this in a logical manner, I completely and utterly understand that this might have affected you and you're clearly annoyed by it - but your general statements are absolutely wrong and formed by a pointed opinion.
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Again I think you're making assumptions here, I've never said it was a "personal attack" - that's crazy.

I have already said that I understand there were reasons for removing it but that the way PB handled it was very telling of how much they really cared. I refer back to their statement;

"Our current winter work programme has seen the permanent closure and dismantling of the Wild Mouse and the removal of the facade of the former Trauma Towers attractions. This will create an area for future exciting developments. Blackpool Pleasure Beach is a constantly evolving amusement park and has been for the past 122 years. The changes it has seen over the years are what has made it the great park it is today. This, coupled with a relatively small amount of space, means that in order to progress and look to the future we occasionally alter the landscape of the park to make way for future developments."

That basically says, "we've cleared this old tat out for progress." For a ride that had been in operation for 59 years, you'd expect something more than a corporate "it's progress" statement.

What happened at PB behind the scenes is irrelevant, this how they chose to communicate it to their customers, therefore is what they should be judged on.

You say a new ride would outweigh a previous one, but did PB really have more visitors in 2018 than the year before? Icon's queue rarely went above 30 minutes on any of my visits, and was often close to walk-on.
 
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Coaster said:
What happened at PB behind the scenes is irrelevant, this how they chose to communicate it to their customers, therefore is what they should be judged on.

You say a new ride would outweigh a previous one, but did PB really have more visitors in 2018 than the year before? Icon's queue rarely went above 30 minutes on any of my visits, and was often close to walk-on.
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I agree it's a weak statement, but I don't think many people are that hung up about it now, 1 year on. Yes, they had an opportunity to make more out of it, but they didn't. And so life moves on.

Don't know how many times it has to be said that visitor numbers aren't the only way to judge success. And the first year of an attraction doesn't always define it's success either.

Equally, a ride's queue time can't always be used to judge popularity. It could simply be that with the people visiting on, and the throughput it has, 30 minutes it's a current natural maximum. And people aren't going to choose to wait longer than that when they know it will be quieter at a different time. For a fun example to show this - I have never seen the queue for Black Mamba at Phantasialand get longer than 20 minutes: does that mean it's an unpopular ride?
 
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