Cedar Point | Top Thrill 2 | Triple Launch Renovation | 2024
- Thread starter Wazzupnerds
- Start date
JackFish
Mega Poster
Thanks for the clarification @MLDesigns!
CrashCoaster
CF Legend
I've discovered @Matt N's alter ego.
Qsilverrdc
Roller Poster
So here are a couple things and another concept image.
From a safety and capacity look.
Say that the redo has some kind of a spike in conjunction with the first top hat section.
Zone 1: A switching track would be required, or a method to transfer the train to the Spike, accelerator, Top hat section. Only 1 train can be in this section. The train comes to a full stop after entering zone 1. This allows the switch track to confirm ride position, and will allow for a similar launch feel. About 6 sec's of noise and lights, then the launch. Then about 7 sec’s run to roll back, 5 sec's back to launch point, about 5 up the Spike and 5 more down, then about 5 more to clear the top hat. About 33 sec's, Now 2 sec for the switch to move, and 5 for the train to get to launch position. 40 sec’s per car. If similar sized at 18 riders per train gives a maximum capacity of 2.23 sec’s per person, or 1,620 riders per hour. I found this interesting that this is slightly more than current design. For safety all mostly needed is the EM launch flags which do not need to move up or down, and these work in both directions.
Zone 2: Top hat to super air hill peek to 2nd hat. So we have a train going about 120 mph at the bottom of the top hat. Let’s add an shallow zero negative G airtime hill and a 2nd high hill/top hat. I would guess about 180ft tall. Taller some energy is added. This is on the spike tower structure. The train should clear this zone about 14 sec’s after exiting zone 1 where the next train is about to launch.
At this point we have a train 180ft up, and a system that has mostly used conventional proven braking systems. No magnetic braking flags as before…
Zones 3 and 4 Just guessing, about 10 sec each. 50mph, and 30mph. Now into the unload. Zone 5 (safety hold) , Zone 6 unload, zone 7 transfer to Load.
Zone 8 load.
I think this kind of a redo would increase the uptime, ride rate, and enjoyment.
New time and experience: Gates open to load 40 sec’s. Transfer to launch section 7 sec’s, the show 6 sec’s, 27 Sec’s to clear top hat 1, 14 sec’s to top of top hat 2. Another 20 sec’s to the unload safety hold, 10 more to unload, 40 sec’s to unload. 2 min 44 sec’s total time. 1 min 24 sec’s ride.
The longest zone is 40 sec, so 4.1 trains needed to make rate. Zone 1, 8, 6, (2,3,4), Zone 7 are available for 5 trains.
I don't think the load cover will stay where it is, it will get moved, but reused.
From a safety and capacity look.
Say that the redo has some kind of a spike in conjunction with the first top hat section.
Zone 1: A switching track would be required, or a method to transfer the train to the Spike, accelerator, Top hat section. Only 1 train can be in this section. The train comes to a full stop after entering zone 1. This allows the switch track to confirm ride position, and will allow for a similar launch feel. About 6 sec's of noise and lights, then the launch. Then about 7 sec’s run to roll back, 5 sec's back to launch point, about 5 up the Spike and 5 more down, then about 5 more to clear the top hat. About 33 sec's, Now 2 sec for the switch to move, and 5 for the train to get to launch position. 40 sec’s per car. If similar sized at 18 riders per train gives a maximum capacity of 2.23 sec’s per person, or 1,620 riders per hour. I found this interesting that this is slightly more than current design. For safety all mostly needed is the EM launch flags which do not need to move up or down, and these work in both directions.
Zone 2: Top hat to super air hill peek to 2nd hat. So we have a train going about 120 mph at the bottom of the top hat. Let’s add an shallow zero negative G airtime hill and a 2nd high hill/top hat. I would guess about 180ft tall. Taller some energy is added. This is on the spike tower structure. The train should clear this zone about 14 sec’s after exiting zone 1 where the next train is about to launch.
At this point we have a train 180ft up, and a system that has mostly used conventional proven braking systems. No magnetic braking flags as before…
Zones 3 and 4 Just guessing, about 10 sec each. 50mph, and 30mph. Now into the unload. Zone 5 (safety hold) , Zone 6 unload, zone 7 transfer to Load.
Zone 8 load.
I think this kind of a redo would increase the uptime, ride rate, and enjoyment.
New time and experience: Gates open to load 40 sec’s. Transfer to launch section 7 sec’s, the show 6 sec’s, 27 Sec’s to clear top hat 1, 14 sec’s to top of top hat 2. Another 20 sec’s to the unload safety hold, 10 more to unload, 40 sec’s to unload. 2 min 44 sec’s total time. 1 min 24 sec’s ride.
The longest zone is 40 sec, so 4.1 trains needed to make rate. Zone 1, 8, 6, (2,3,4), Zone 7 are available for 5 trains.
I don't think the load cover will stay where it is, it will get moved, but reused.
JackFish
Mega Poster
This is kind of genius.
Crazycoaster
Giga Poster
It’s a nice idea, but it will never happen. The ride will have a reverse spike, that’s all. We would have seen land clearing and footer pouring if there’d be more, and that would have been done at the same time as the other footers were poured.
JackFish
Mega Poster
I can be hopeful If I want to
Qsilverrdc
Roller Poster
I guess that I disagree with you here. I will be disappointed if the "reimagination" is to only add a 300ft reverse spike and EM launch and EM braking system. I mean why spend a several million on the Triangle tower (expected) for just adding this element. Since it's not a "Dragster" accelerate then stop with a reverse. There is a huge safety gain by adding the return portions of the track. As far as footers go, 3 months before attaching components is enough. I don't think the lack of additional footers at this time means too much. I guess we will see.
Steely Dan
Mega Poster
As someone involved in the construction industry for nearly 3 decades now (not coaster construction, just general), there would be no reason (from a money standpoint) not to do all planned foundation work all at the same time. Once the necessary subs and their equipment are mobilized on site, you start all foundation work, and then you finish all foundation work, unless there are peculiarities of the project and/or site that necessitate spending the extra money to remobilize the excavation and concrete crews two or more times for a more complicated phased schedule of the foundation work.
The only possible "peculiarity" I see with this project that might cause CP to go with that more expensive route would be to "temporarily trick some nerds on the internet".
Seems like a fairly foolish and needless expenditure to me, but what do I care, I'm not CF shareholder.
Crazycoaster
Giga Poster
The lack of footers does exactly mean that, unfortunately. Especially when you add in the extra logistics of putting these footers inside the Iron Dragon ride area/surrounding woodland.
As much as I would love there to be more, it just sounds very similar to 2002, back when the original TTD tower started rising, and loads of people were adamant the ride would do much more than just a top hat.
I think the most unusual thing as of now is the fact that they have not removed/moved the original station canopy.
As much as I would love there to be more, it just sounds very similar to 2002, back when the original TTD tower started rising, and loads of people were adamant the ride would do much more than just a top hat.
I think the most unusual thing as of now is the fact that they have not removed/moved the original station canopy.
Inverting_Thrills
Mega Poster
Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see this but it's just not happening. The most that's happening, in my opinion is a spike and an airtime hill. The spike, LSM retrofit, and new trains will cost a pretty large amount of money alone. Adding an entire layout beyond that would be even more expensive. That's not even to mention that Cedar Point, as many other amusement parks are, is still recovering from a pandemic.
JackFish
Mega Poster
They might still be recovering from the pandemic. But they are the flagship park so they will have greater investment than other parks. So I don't know if the pandemic will be the reason for the extended layout not happening. The more likely reason is space. There is just simply not enough space to expand it without removing iron dragon. They already added track pieces back so It is safe to assume that they will keep it since it would add even more cost to remove the whole thing right after adding those pieces back.
This. Footers, or at the very least other land clearing, are the dead giveaways for where track will be installed. And it has been CP's approach to do this during the off-season, which allows for construction to remains as unobtrusive/confined to the coaster footprint as possible during the season. Not having seen any other footer laying activity outside of the backspike, the window quickly closes for "other track work" to be plausible.
A couple things:
- I wouldn't call it "disappointment", but I think everyone in the room would agree it would've been great to have more than a back spike addition.
- "Why spend millions for a back spike" - to keep the coaster operational. The alternative is have a quite-sunk asset sitting in the middle of the park, which would cost millions still to remove. It's sunk cost fallacy at it's finest; at least you have a pathway to still operate one of the tallest, fastest coasters in the world.
- The name "Dragster" could very well (and I would almost bet) disappear. Renaming roller coasters with major retrofits and modifications is a time tested practice, so it's not a stretch to think the drag racing theme is ditched. And yes, that's a bummer, as it fit TTD's ride experience and thematic to a perfect T.
Qsilverrdc
Roller Poster
Imagination.. Yes maybe that's a good thing. Would not need to be inside of Iron Dragon any more than is already done.
Many are saying they are done with footers, etc. but there is still much construction activity going on. If they were to put an air time hill on the return, I don't think there is enough room for slowing the cars. This gets back into the problem of safety zones and slow cycle... I will keep watching to see what they do. Hope some fantasy wins the day. lol
It is a point to mention that surely the brake run is going to be made into an airtime hill or at least made to start way higher than it ends.. surely? Due to the issue of how long empty trains take to clear it when testing? Are there currently footers for that? Or is there none needed?
