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Coronavirus: Impact on Theme Parks

Places are going to be weighing up the PR of running events, nobody is going to want to be the first to open just before a second wave hits only to get hit the bad press of getting "blamed" for people going there.

With some of the smaller big events, like town christmas lights, they're going to be considering the economics of running the event with half the punters if we're still having to socially distance ourselves. When I was at uni in Stafford the town used to get jam-packed from one end of the high street to the other, with some fair rides, big screen, and lots of food & drink vans. There was no way to maintain any kind of distance from people, so capacity would have to be cut drastically. But then you're in the situation of how do you cheaply and effectively manage capacity in a town centre, and how do you stop people coming down and standing just outside the barriers to get a look?
It’s similar where I’m from, huge event with a fair, live bands, fireworks show, stalls etc, all of which need to planned, booked and paid for in advance. Then on the night the market square is packed shoulder to shoulder, which obviously couldn’t happen if SD measures are still in place... This is the very definition of a mass gathering, and I don’t blame them for not wanting to gamble any time or money on them being permitted any time this year.
 
At least we've met the test target of 100.000+ per day in the UK now after such a poor start. Hopefully it helps to keep the virus contained more and cases and thus death numbers drop quicker.
 
^ well apart from that isn't true and is just Tory spin.

(122,347 is the number they trotted out, 73,191 is the number they actually tested. The difference being the tests they have just mailed out)
SOURCE ; here
 
Well as your post was a direct response to this...



Can you forgive me for thinking we were still discussing Theme Parks in relation to MGs or events? The reason for this assumption was because I thought you were aware that large groups outside is considered much lower risk, unless in a MG setting.

You say that they should reopen AFTER pubs and restaurants... As a pub company owning theme park enthusiast I feel I have enough personal knowledge (without the scientific data which DOES back this up) to say that’s also incorrect, small indoor spaces are much higher risk than anything outdoors. Hence the reason pubs and restaurants closed way before theme parks.

That being said, it is probably a fair point to suggest that they should open alongside each other, give that the business model of many parks involves indoor spaces, such as restaurants, bars, hotels etc. Or they could do what they did just before lockdown and close all indoor hospitality sections and only offer the ’takeaway’ options.

Edited to add a little bit of ‘further reading’ for anybody interested



Thanks for your response. Yes, I understand where you were coming from. Thanks for the links!
 
^ well apart from that isn't true and is just Tory spin.

(122,347 is the number they trotted out, 73,191 is the number they actually tested. The difference being the tests they have just mailed out)
SOURCE ; here

I think, for this purpose, it’s reasonably fair to count all tests administered at the point of administration? As in when the sample is taken in a centre, or when the test kit is mailed...

The reason I think that is because the target was about capacity more than the results, the results will come... I understand why it’s seen as a questionable tactic to include these, but lets not forget it’s the capacity to now do this that is the important factor, not some silly game of cat and mouse between the press and government. Who cares if they hit that 100k target yesterday, when the tests began being despatched on mass, or early next week when the results are in... As long as that 100k a day capacity is now there.

If it is, this is genuinely great news, and will mean we are on track to begin slowly unlocking this month. :)
 
With my limited understanding of Dutch I'll first point out but in this clip Walibi Holland's director talks about how entry will only be via prebooked online tickets and the measures to ensure a 1.5m distance between people in the park: spacing in queuelines, plastic shields will be put in cattlepen queues and they will run coasters with 1 guest per row and every alternate row empty. So basically a 1/4 of the capacity. Untamed for example would have a throughput of 225 riders per hour (900 normally).
You've got to wonder is it actually worth the operating costs?
 
With my limited understanding of Dutch I'll first point out but in this clip Walibi Holland's director talks about how entry will only be via prebooked online tickets and the measures to ensure a 1.5m distance between people in the park: spacing in queuelines, plastic shields will be put in cattlepen queues and they will run coasters with 1 guest per row and every alternate row empty. So basically a 1/4 of the capacity. Untamed for example would have a throughput of 225 riders per hour (900 normally).
You've got to wonder is it actually worth the operating costs?
Does seem a bit of an odd choice, should just have been an empty row between each ‘family / group’ to achieve the same level of social distancing, unless that’s what it does mean...
 
With my limited understanding of Dutch I'll first point out but in this clip Walibi Holland's director talks about how entry will only be via prebooked online tickets and the measures to ensure a 1.5m distance between people in the park: spacing in queuelines, plastic shields will be put in cattlepen queues and they will run coasters with 1 guest per row and every alternate row empty. So basically a 1/4 of the capacity. Untamed for example would have a throughput of 225 riders per hour (900 normally).
You've got to wonder is it actually worth the operating costs?

Nee, het is het niet waard.
*(No, it is not worth it)
 
Untamed for example would have a throughput of 225 riders per hour (900 normally).

Don't think it even makes 225 when on 1 train ops!
 
Just going back to the fact that zoos and museums have already reopened in Germany. The social implications of going to a zoo/museum are far different than of going to a theme park. If I'm correct the advice in Germany is to still remain in your household groups and no meet-ups of more than 2 outside your household gathering. I see going to the zoo/museum much more of a family affair whereas whilst a theme park is something you may do with family, it is more typically a social gathering with friends. This requires the congregation of multiple different households together which is probably why governments are more hesitant to allow leisure activities like theme parks open as it encourages higher levels of social congregation.

At more family based parks such as Efteling, Toverland, Legoland and chessington a theme park may be more a family affair where you can stick to your household groups but when looking at a park like Thorpe Park for example, I think you rarely see a family group set foot into the park, it is much more of a place for locals (chavs) to congregate, and therefore it should be discouraged that a place like this should open up in the near future.

I assume this is why the Dutch theme park association are saying only groups from the same family/household would be allowed to meet up at the park, rather than allowing groups of friends as this encourages more social interaction which can escalate the spread of the virus. This perhaps won't be such a problem for parks such as Efteling and Toverland where it is predominantly families visiting, however may be much more of an issue for Walibi where it is usually groups of friends meeting up.
Untamed for example would have a throughput of 225 riders per hour (900 normally).

Don't think it even makes 225 when on 1 train ops!

When I was there on a quiet day in September, yes untamed was new, but every coaster in the park was 0 minutes wait. Untamed was 50, started on one train and later came onto two. The dispatches were so slow, even on two trains. Maybe one every 5 minutes, which can't be a throughput of more than 300-400pph or so lol. At least the dispatches might be a bit faster when only loading 4-7 people per train. Doesn't take away from what a brilliant coaster it is though.
 
Highly unlikely... I’m fairy confident that a second wave will not be bigger than the first in the UK for several reasons. 1) Immunity in society 2) Prevention measures, we’re all generally much better at social distancing and hygiene now 3) Reaction plans... Before the lifting plans are laid out, there will be counter plans in place to respond to any rises in numbers. This is why they’re being very cautious about how they’re lifting the lockdown.

I know the media like to print alarming headlines, and there will no doubt be a second wave, or a prolonged continuation of the tail end of the first wave, but it is highly unlikely that it will be worse than, or even as bad as, the first.

The only example the media like to repeat to help with their fear mongering is the Spanish flu... With suggestions that a larger second wave happened then so could happen now... You should look up the first wave of the Spanish flu, you’ll immediately see a very clear difference... https://www.cdc.gov/flu/pandemic-resources/1918-commemoration/pandemic-timeline-1918.htm

4) Usable test results are finally starting to come in.

The dutch healthcare numbers are: 14000 tested infected (probably way more are untested) of whom approx 460 are (shortly) hospitalized.
Thats 3.2%
9 of 14000 died. That's 0,07% of total infections and 2% of the hospitalizations.

Note: these are people below age 70. At least 6 of 9 deaths had other illnesses.
The 3.2% of hospitalizations is from 14000 people of which undoubtedly include a lot with other illnesses.
The real number of infections is probably much higher so the risc of hospitalization or death even lower.

It will also become more clear who actually is at high risc, based on age, lifestyle and medical conditions.
Those people could be provided with proper grade ppe to protect them while doing necessary social activities like buying food..

This will dramatically decrease the death toll, while the percentage of immunity goes up. Especially if they start to open bars, restaurants, gyms etc. Like in Sweden. With measurements in place.

Keeping everything closes is unsustainable as 60% of bar and restaurants are facing bankruptcy by the end of june.
Unless of course provides another bunch of free billions.

But that's not sustainable either. Tax payers will pay the price for that.
 
Why make people who are living in the same house as family sit apart?
Seems a silly rule to me.
Seperate the family groups, that makes sense, but not every individual.
 
how will they know who is in a family? will you have to show birth certificates, proof of residence in the same house?

if not family groups will grow exponentially
 
I think, for this purpose, it’s reasonably fair to count all tests administered at the point of administration? As in when the sample is taken in a centre, or when the test kit is mailed...

The reason I think that is because the target was about capacity more than the results, the results will come... I understand why it’s seen as a questionable tactic to include these, but lets not forget it’s the capacity to now do this that is the important factor, not some silly game of cat and mouse between the press and government. Who cares if they hit that 100k target yesterday, when the tests began being despatched on mass, or early next week when the results are in... As long as that 100k a day capacity is now there.

If it is, this is genuinely great news, and will mean we are on track to begin slowly unlocking this month. :)

I mean the government clearly cared about it as an arbitrary measure given they changed how they were counting them on the 28th April to ensure they could include mailed tests, even though they clearly stated the target was 100k people TESTED, not 100k tests sent out.

The whole thing is a smokescreen anyway, I don't care how many tests you do a day because in the grand scheme of things, what good is it being tested? The initial point of it was that if you were a key worker and self-isolating because you were worrying you had symptoms you had to isolate and therefore be off the front line. Taking a test would mean you could know within 48 hours if you could go back to work and help (which was vital). Fine.

But if you order a home kit now, it takes 48 hours to receive, another 24 hours to get it collect, and then 48 hours for results - you may as well just self isolate yourself for the 7 days regardless.

This entire 100k thing has just become one big misnomer to blind con people into thinking they're handling it well when the reality is we're on course for the worst death rate in Europe.
 
I mean the government clearly cared about it as an arbitrary measure given they changed how they were counting them on the 28th April to ensure they could include mailed tests, even though they clearly stated the target was 100k people TESTED, not 100k tests sent out.

The whole thing is a smokescreen anyway, I don't care how many tests you do a day because in the grand scheme of things, what good is it being tested? The initial point of it was that if you were a key worker and self-isolating because you were worrying you had symptoms you had to isolate and therefore be off the front line. Taking a test would mean you could know within 48 hours if you could go back to work and help (which was vital). Fine.

But if you order a home kit now, it takes 48 hours to receive, another 24 hours to get it collect, and then 48 hours for results - you may as well just self isolate yourself for the 7 days regardless.

This entire 100k thing has just become one big misnomer to blind con people into thinking they're handling it well when the reality is we're on course for the worst death rate in Europe.
I think the home tests are for those that cannot get to a centre, from what I can tell they carried out 80k tests at test centres with more coming online over the next few days. This is vital for test, track and trace.

I also read that the home testing network is being built and scaled up to offer serology testing, that is it’s main intended purpose. This will allow us to get a clearer picture of infection rates, which I’m sure will be in the top 2 or 3 in the world in terms of cases per capita, due to our high death amounts and previous lack of testing.

Back onto the effect on theme parks and other businesses, if anybody is interested we’re now starting to consider how we can safely trade under social distancing measures in the pub.

We think it’s going to be booking only inside, with reduced numbers of tables, so probably dining only. No vertical drinking, so if you don’t have a table you cannot come in.

It will most likely either be table service only, with orders being taken for food and drinks by waiting staff at distance in PPE. Or we could choose to turn the takeaway section of our app into a table ordering section similar to how spoon’s app works, so that customers must order via the app.

When drinks / food are ready we will place them at a pre arranged collection point and call the customer’s order number.

The garden is where we have more freedom, being a country pub it’s huge and already has space for every table to be at a distance with room to spare. This will be where people can ‘drop in for a drink.’ With a safe order and collection point, probably with perspex screening, built specifically for the garden. You’ll order at this booth, take a seat until your order is brought out, and your number called, then you’ll come and collect your order.

Things are going to be VERY different for a good few months I think.
 
Re: Pubs - gonna be a tricky time for the rest of the year for anyone, let alone those without beer gardens! Good luck.
I like what this is proposing (are you aware of it?) https://www.hospitalityunion.co.uk/ but not sure I can see all the Tory-voting big-business/landlords going along with it.
#NationalTimeOut
 
The whole thing is a smokescreen anyway, I don't care how many tests you do a day because in the grand scheme of things, what good is it being tested? The initial point of it was that if you were a key worker and self-isolating because you were worrying you had symptoms you had to isolate and therefore be off the front line. Taking a test would mean you could know within 48 hours if you could go back to work and help (which was vital). Fine.

Testing is so important so that infection chains can be caught amidst their tracks and stopped before they spiral out of control. This is what we "claimed" to be doing back in February whereas in reality we couldn't trace back to patient zero because we couldn't perform any tests, whereas in Germany thousands and thousands of tests a day were being conducted, so they could trace back to those infected individuals and stop infection chains growing at an even faster rate.

The issue is in the UK now, maybe we are doing 80k tests a day, so 500k tests a week. Great. We need to test test test. But what we don't know is if the government are actually using that data in a proactive way. At this point, with a reproductive rate less than one, for one infected individual, everyone else in their household should be taking a test to see if they are also infected, symptomatic or asymptomatic. Then we can start to gather more data about how quickly the virus really spreads and what the real proportion of asymptomatic people is.

Testing is going to become a key part of the exit strategy to the current lockdown, but only if we use the data it provides right. Unfortunately, in my personal opinion, every decision the government has made so far has been incredibly wrong, so I'm not sure I particularly trust them to be able to use this data in the right way. If, along with a well planned exit strategy, we can test 700,000 people a week, catch those infections chains and reduce the curve of the second wave, then we have finally done something right.

I think the government needs to also turn attention to stepping up production of cloth face masks within the UK. As we have seen, it looks like Boris is going to thankfully U-turn on the advice given by SAGE that masks aren't of use and is hopefully going to tell us to wear them next week. I'm hoping he calls out for local manufacturing chains to start producing as many cloth facemasks as they can and distribute them throughout the local area. Similarly schools with design and technology departments could be called upon to start producing cloth masks for their local community. That way, we aren't taking away from PPE from frontline healthcare staff.

It's so important that moving forward over the next few weeks the reproductive rate is kept less than one. High volume testing and the right use of the data it provides is a key to this. PPE such as face masks and continued social distancing measures are also a key to this. Hopefully the government can get it right and we can flatten the curve of the second wave.

Of course, we don't already know how many people have antibodies and we don't know the level of immunity the antibodies provide to this virus. This is where antibody testing could have come in useful, so we know what the true scale of the outbreak has been in the UK. In Germany, 15% of the population seemingly have antibodies, so it will be a way higher amount here. If antibodies provide a high level immunity against re-contracting the virus, then the infection rate will dramatically drop in the UK naturally as so many people will have that immunity already.
 
Re: Pubs - gonna be a tricky time for the rest of the year for anyone, let alone those without beer gardens! Good luck.
I like what this is proposing (are you aware of it?) https://www.hospitalityunion.co.uk/ but not sure I can see all the Tory-voting big-business/landlords going along with it.
#NationalTimeOut

Thanks for the link, I wasn’t aware of that scheme. Seems like a great idea, especially for those companies tied to and renting from a brewery. We’re a free house though, we’re not tied to any brewery or major pub company, the building is privately owned. So in that sense we’re very lucky.

Doesn’t mean we’re out of the woods by a any measure though, we have many other costs that continue to accrue despite no income... Electricity, Gas and water, despite reduced consumption there are also fixed charges attached to these, phone lines, internet, even card processing is still costing us, despite not processing, as again there are fixed fees. We have rented equipment in the pub, which obviously still needs paying for.

These are just a few examples people may not think of when considering the costs we’re still accruing that need to paid for despite no income.

We also look to lose around £10k of stock, this is where being a free house has stung us, some breweries covered this for their tied tenants, we are obviously not tied.

For us the most important solution is to either get back to work in a safe way as quickly as possible, or to be told we’ll be locked down much longer and financially assisted for the extended period. I personally think we’ll be allowed to open in the next 6 - 8 weeks with strict social distancing measures... But we’ll see.
 
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